Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large communities (Attribute 30) was squatted on..)
Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org> Fri, 28 October 2016 14:51 UTC
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Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 10:54:13 -0400
From: Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org>
To: "John G. Scudder" <jgs@juniper.net>
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Subject: Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large communities (Attribute 30) was squatted on..)
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On Fri, Oct 28, 2016 at 10:40:21AM -0400, John G. Scudder wrote: > I'm not aware of a precedent for specifying a timeout in a deprecation, in > fact I'm not sure what it means. I'm not sure what benefit it would bring > either. I do see Sue's message you referenced, but the point of that, and > also my own message around the same time, is that deprecation is one step > in the state machine, necessary before code point reuse. I don't think we > need to either specify either a minimum, nor a maximum, time the code > point may spend in that state. A somewhat relevant analogy is that toxic spills tend to last in the environment a rather long time, even with active cleanup work. This has been the thought behind most of my prior comments about avoiding the need to burn attributes. And while... > I note that in parallel the working group has been discussing the idea of > reusing these code points to expand the Experimental range (currently > called "reserved for development"), so we may end up reusing them rather > soon. In any case, deprecation is the first step toward doing that, so I > think we may as well just get on with it with a minimum of fuss. I think we'll find that using the existing attribute range in such a way simply will leave further toxic waste. We're simply causing people different sorts of pain as we move around the contamination. For example, vendor A uses 30 for testing a feature and it escapes into the wild. It runs into the existing issue. The issue is really more to do with development and testing practices than code points in particular. Code point hygeine simply helps mitigate issues in those practices. -- Jeff
- [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (Attrib… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… bruno.decraene
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Michael H Lambert
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jared Mauch
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Kristian Larsson
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Dickinson, Ian
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Julian Seifert
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Peter Hessler
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… John G. Scudder
- [Idr] Early allocation for wide communities [was:… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Susan Hares
- [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Peter Hessler
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Wesley George
- Re: [Idr] Early allocation for wide communities [… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] Early allocation for wide communities [… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Jared Mauch
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild 'Peter Hessler'
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Early allocation for wide communities [… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] Early allocation for wide communities [… Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] Early allocation for wide communities [… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Early allocation for wide communities [… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… marco
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… marco
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Geoff Huston
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… t.petch
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Paul Jakma
- [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (Attrib… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Alvaro Retana (aretana)
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Susan Hares
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Randy Bush
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Brian Dickson
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… heasley
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… heasley
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… marco
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Sander Steffann
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Sander Steffann
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… marco
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… t.petch
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… marco
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Brian Dickson
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Randy Bush
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Thomas Mangin
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Thomas Mangin
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… heasley
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Brian Dickson
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] Squatters (Was: BGP Attribute for Large… marco
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Colin Petrie
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Job Snijders
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Colin Petrie
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] Unknown Attributes seen in the wild Jakob Heitz (jheitz)
- Re: [Idr] BGP Attribute for Large communities (At… Zhuangshunwan