Re: [Int-dir] use-cases in Problem Statement
NABIL BENAMAR <n.benamar@est.umi.ac.ma> Wed, 17 April 2019 11:19 UTC
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From: NABIL BENAMAR <n.benamar@est.umi.ac.ma>
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2019 12:18:42 +0100
Message-ID: <CAD8vqFfjaASv0sFMoLSCT9LdS_kSv7Yp4xZBQxv+Nete+LyCwQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
Cc: "Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)" <sgundave@cisco.com>, Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, nabil benamar <benamar73@gmail.com>, "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>, "ietf@ietf.org" <ietf@ietf.org>, "its@ietf.org" <its@ietf.org>, "int-dir@ietf.org" <int-dir@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb.all@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Int-dir] use-cases in Problem Statement
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It's a good idea to refer to Vulnerable Road Users which refer to bicycles as well as pedestrians. On Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 12:12 Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Le 16/04/2019 à 05:11, Sri Gundavelli (sgundave) a écrit : > >> I am no expert, but I do know some physics, and it seems pretty > >> clear to me that if there are multiple lanes of traffic, a large > >> truck can easily shield signals between two cars and the shielding > >> will be intermittent, regardless of how much wireless power is > >> allowed, depending on traffic movement. So it's a highly dynamic > >> mesh network. > > > > > > Part of the problem is that we have not clearly put some limits on > > the use-cases. These unbounded limits is opening up these discussions > > on ad-hoc full mesh network formations and the resulting challenging > > ND scenarios. But, again I always assumed this discussion is for the > > ND document and there should be no bearing on this document. > > > > V2X communications involves V2V, V2I and V2P communication modes. > > For the term V2P (Vehicle to Pedestrian) I would like to suggest > addition of term VRU as well: Vulnerable Road Users. I suggest the new > term V2VRU: Vehicle to VRU. > > VRUs dont have OCB interfaces (smartphones's wifi interfaces cant be set > at 5.9GHz), yet they are at most risk since they are not protected by > cages like the automobiles are. > > V2VRU is a problem, because OCB-equipped vehicles can communicate to > OCB-free VRUs only by means of high-latency cellular network (50ms 4G vs > 1.5ms OCB). In safety, lower latency is preferred over higher latency. > > I would like to suggest the above addition in the Problem Statement > draft, section 3 "Use Cases". > > > From the point of view of vehicular safety, its about exchange of BSM > > (Basic Safety Messages) between vehicles as per SAEJ735 standard. > > These safety communications is always one-hop communication and for > > very good reason IEEE WAVE standards did not bother to require IPv6 > > transport for carrying these messages. The WSMP message which carries > > these safety elements are defined to be carried over layer-2 > > payloads. Personally, I never thought we will replace this L2 safety > > communication mode with layer-3 mode (IPv6-over-80211-OCB). But the > > use of IPv6 is more for allowing applications in the vehicle to > > communicate with the infrastructure. For example, a vehicle using > > DSRC radio to access some traffic application in the cloud. > > > > In one sense, this is like a mobile node using 802.11-OCB like any > > other radio technology (CDMA, LTE, Wi-Fi), and use IPv6 for its > > communications. In this context, its always about vehicle to > > infrastructure communications. > > I would like to suggest addidion of text about "BSM" in the Problem > Statement draft. > > The localisation corrections are highly needed in OCB, potentially with > BSM and/or other V2X message. > > > Now, there are other interesting peer to peer use-cases, where one > > vehicle is streaming some video to another vehicle without using any > > infrastructure. > > I would like to suggest to add in section "V2V" in the Problem Statement > draft the following text: > > NEW: > > o see thru: streaming video from one vehicle to another vehicle > > without using any infrastructure, to see through obstacles > > > > > While these later examples are very cool, personally, I did not > > expect this WG to solve those use-cases day-1. > > I would like to suggest the addition of the term "day-1" to the Problem > Statement draft. > > > For us to support those use-cases, we need to figure out many more > > things including approaches for exchanges prefixes between two > > vehicles that come in proximity. In my mind, these are very forward > > looking and the only relevant application is platooning. I am not > > interested in solving this V2V problem, but was more interested to > > enable V2I communications, where the focus is about link model, > > prefix hosting approaches, mobility support (building a large L2 > > domain over RSU’s, or routed approaches with mobile IP type > > protocols) ..etc. In one realization, there may be a P2P link > > assumption between the vehicle and the RSU, eliminating most of these > > ND issues. But, those discussions are for the other document and that > > clearly should remove these ND concerns from this document. > > I agree. > > Alex >
- [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-ipwav… Pascal Thubert
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre PETRESCU
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… NABIL BENAMAR
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Charlie Perkins
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Rob Wilton (rwilton)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Ole Troan
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Ole Troan
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Ole Troan
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Ole Troan
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… NABIL BENAMAR
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Ole Troan
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre PETRESCU
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Ole Troan
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- [Int-dir] IPv6-over-foo and Addressing Architectu… Suresh Krishnan
- Re: [Int-dir] IPv6-over-foo and Addressing Archit… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… William Whyte
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] about V2I to traffic lights control… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Intdir early review of draft-ietf-i… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… NABIL BENAMAR
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Nabil Benamar
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… NABIL BENAMAR
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Alexandre Petrescu
- [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early revie… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… NABIL BENAMAR
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Nabil Benamar
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Intdir early review of dra… Jong-Hyouk Lee
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] pencil and paper vs cars Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] Expertise on ND problems on OCB Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Expertise on ND problems o… Charlie Perkins
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Brian E Carpenter
- [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb an… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)
- Re: [Int-dir] which BSM? Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] ND-over-OCB hidden terminals: truck… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] link-local text (Re: Intdir early r… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] use-cases in Problem Statement Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] use-cases in Problem Statement NABIL BENAMAR
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Eric Gray
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] side note RFC 4291 2nd par sec. 2.1… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211oc… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Suresh Krishnan
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 神明達哉
- Re: [Int-dir] 118 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Expertise on ND problems o… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Expertise on ND problems o… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [Int-dir] [ipwave] Expertise on ND problems o… Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)