Re: [IPv6] Adoption call for draft-bctb-6man-rfc6296-bis

[Brian E Carpenter <[e-mail]>]

On 22-Mar-24 22:36, Ole Troan wrote:
> Naoki,
> 
>> I don't support adoption.
>>
>> When NAT was first introduced, I experienced a lot of trouble. There may be fewer problems these days, but I think the reason is that applications are built with NAT in mind. In other words, I think it limits the ability to create applications.
>>
>> I think it is undesirable that something works in an environment without NAT but does not work in an environment with NAT. If this happens, should I fix the application or the network?
>>
>> I think it would be desirable to regain an environment where applications can be created without restrictions, and I think that would make the Internet better.
>>
>> Even though IPv6 can eliminate this restriction, I do not agree with restricting applications with NPTv6.
> 
> Could you say a little more about _how_ NPTv6 restricts applications?

That's a slightly strange question since the draft already has a "Implications for Applications" section. Possibly it needs modernisation.

But I think Naoki is missing the trade-off here, and the comparison with our bad experience with NAPT44
and even with NAT444 is too simple.

There are a few scenarios where NPTv6 makes things better for a user, because otherwise they will lose connectivity. Outside those scenarios, NPTv6 is a bad thing and should not be enabled.

It's quite different from NAPT44. I could not use any IPv4-only resource without NAPT44. I can use every IPv6 resource without NPTv6. That's the situation for the majority of users.

    Brian

> 
> Cheers,
> Ole
> 
> PS: And for this discussion let’s assume NAT64 doesn’t exist, which of course restricts any IPv6 application to be equivalent to sitting behind a NAPT44.
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