Re: Network merge [Re: RFC6724-bis?]

David Farmer <farmer@umn.edu> Sat, 24 September 2022 23:39 UTC

Return-Path: <farmer@umn.edu>
X-Original-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F30C3C14F74E for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 16:39:16 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -7.108
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.108 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=umn.edu
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5Q_udaT4Npqx for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 16:39:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mta-p7.oit.umn.edu (mta-p7.oit.umn.edu [134.84.196.207]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9F097C14F747 for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 16:39:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mta-p7.oit.umn.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4MZlpk2WgJz9vC7j for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 23:39:10 +0000 (UTC)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at umn.edu
Received: from mta-p7.oit.umn.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mta-p7.oit.umn.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cKo_b-6z1Qwf for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 18:39:10 -0500 (CDT)
Received: from mail-ed1-f71.google.com (mail-ed1-f71.google.com [209.85.208.71]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mta-p7.oit.umn.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4MZlpj6H0sz9vC7g for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 18:39:09 -0500 (CDT)
DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mta-p7.oit.umn.edu 4MZlpj6H0sz9vC7g
DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 mta-p7.oit.umn.edu 4MZlpj6H0sz9vC7g
Received: by mail-ed1-f71.google.com with SMTP id b17-20020a056402351100b00453b19d9bd0so2561277edd.4 for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 16:39:09 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=umn.edu; s=google; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=vvo3Y/EzQ4YVWn1Wr9Lw7pgnT/oq3vSyZ8/wDxWKZ5g=; b=VkFyF5s0BIaOBxiwBo7vvdPLgK9a5hy0VkiacHPLhTm1MOkTf85rXdEzh05N4OauFP DUGp/Do2WduMfbv2E6SyP3x48ULYkre39t8o5dtoJgKioj1fbC90QTZvIQiDdM/KOdUN CYk+0a/YDra0GjQYhVJAbob4Zo4Ts9QYNJfGSwnwBbObhkpbNMUI6YzSgFDJCAHY/BhG +AyMIdpDug5GggW5/JlnwX3DiWHbp6UVQa1tRJvUy743EDI8C0EXi+NsZ/KIOtwSeehN mcTaN+4/ejzHzJ7wjxffD0rEQ2jvUkrqrBHkswy+bS6NKieIYl/7mVutSLW7gwyS7Rai E8sg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=vvo3Y/EzQ4YVWn1Wr9Lw7pgnT/oq3vSyZ8/wDxWKZ5g=; b=DnDr97RMNwOgrE5WwZa+jyWXqI7gmwG0DrT2MuDy1Xm1jEGuvU5FcFPMwvAbMwU1xU XbhXpD4ULPUnCFLXZWm/QhnlGsrYReAhBX3WPMUpLU28wEiZUOf5q0UzWFYtP4nNUzSm tvtZLQsd2v2jzAYXcDt7JkPmie6/kwovN+Pekr2JQDXis+dtuSj+JBbzHoJKRCzWjcoI Fe4LLXi87M81JizEOGmj/7A93am2dVuIjvu+3gpQVqDw2ucFwrlIAfgA8rqcHLxv2fzT 0l0Sc+s9wDkKVdoJ3QCDfszN6DF1z87InSM+vJNfmC6tg27b35e6E25pGW8Tk41hTXtX I0vQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: ACrzQf3FOAo6WMZegzzbphfSW/ne+aksink1D7UwEjqaq4bY/kDOBoN2 QWP51ewcFwTTI0BDV0ZTleIICJuea7av2OnKU1e21A81vtthlZLVldM4EMoYsi73j1grv7SOI8Z 3uHaZCjbhtlpuKsrvHafMUrxJ
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:1009:b0:456:f370:5263 with SMTP id c9-20020a056402100900b00456f3705263mr5132424edu.392.1664062748152; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 16:39:08 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMsMyM48uIKhUVvaDP0rZBb+XfSPGMP36uzBfUHfD4MOwbB4YooqHSGB9zMCDy2n5wp2gHIN0JMrf7TwTLORRRa1NoM=
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:1009:b0:456:f370:5263 with SMTP id c9-20020a056402100900b00456f3705263mr5132403edu.392.1664062747787; Sat, 24 Sep 2022 16:39:07 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <66892DC8-6DA4-4DC8-85B0-E1E1647CD9F7@gmail.com> <CAPt1N1=xR_2Xw+1KL6vbzZ69N+vonhcTNvO=DBceeApfoS2bMQ@mail.gmail.com> <e76267b6101146cf8a1bd6fa567c6b77@huawei.com> <CAN-Dau2QO5sxevJwUbOj+_wyiCdOjnPEZM14Jhevvkq4YZqU7Q@mail.gmail.com> <bc85e623-ef89-d2e2-4e33-b8ce0a4ec343@gmail.com> <CAN-Dau0Wbki6xwcEdy8ZK-pO9jeT6+8TKZgbmXWUgnkR+dRhBg@mail.gmail.com> <CAPt1N1=OmC+HNVGWbgj9JtGbpcuzKOgjZ1KXJm5mXgpji-G4Mw@mail.gmail.com> <6edcc5d8-edf1-51de-103c-a4ac6060fef6@gmail.com> <29689d645d22409b962f6c361d71e098@huawei.com> <CAN-Dau3rwi4X4NqLbHMmPQQ=i7y23Kz70JK09ggsXSxkJfT5xA@mail.gmail.com> <bf7c7d74cc7744ef8ded7d043ceb3e5e@huawei.com> <CAN-Dau0=LD9MTYKJQoSw=b9S25nmrNuqRSyLdsztFZscG8ZbUg@mail.gmail.com> <CAPt1N1kjOWh8R70pNO0eH9EJUH-v6HyxGMqxpy0N2hydHN33LQ@mail.gmail.com> <CAM5+tA9mqjrtq3pTggv1pA4fOYXUODkZHy74vs8cffVOrBefbQ@mail.gmail.com> <0b6886d3-5ea9-0a1d-8b16-4e17daeb6924@gmail.com> <CAM5+tA9dAjh0MTRG3922xTe3_aChHFa9AYCFCGmt395KwuvBYA@mail.gmail.com> <cd26ae80-2569-6134-c8b0-247c3b4e32ef@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <cd26ae80-2569-6134-c8b0-247c3b4e32ef@gmail.com>
From: David Farmer <farmer@umn.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2022 18:38:56 -0500
Message-ID: <CAN-Dau2WYS+YRurK3bK+4xraT7iX5Zn6165Njh6BA47hSC4qhQ@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Network merge [Re: RFC6724-bis?]
To: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Cc: 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>, David Farmer <farmer=40umn.edu@dmarc.ietf.org>, Vasilenko Eduard <vasilenko.eduard=40huawei.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, buraglio@es.net
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f75e5c05e974ccf9"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/AGdX2d0EVIWU7yc_cUIhDMENnLA>
X-BeenThere: ipv6@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: "IPv6 Maintenance Working Group \(6man\)" <ipv6.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ipv6/>
List-Post: <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2022 23:39:17 -0000

On Sat, Sep 24, 2022 at 15:38 Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Just focusing on the corner case:
>
> On 25-Sep-22 07:47, Nick Buraglio wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Sep 23, 2022 at 8:12 PM Brian E Carpenter <
> brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com <mailto:brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> ...
> >     But there is still a corner case: if two networks using ULAs are
> >     merged, and the necessary routes are installed, the individual
> >     hosts would still need manual intervention. A high precedence for
> >     fc00::/7 would avoid that.
> >
> >
> > At least to me at this time it seems that although this use case is
> real, it should just be noted as an edge case that is out of scope.
>
> I think we need to say a little more, since the network merge case was one
> of the original motivations for ULAs in the first place (otherwise,
> statistical uniqueness has no real value).
>
> At least, we need to say that in the case of a network merge, human
> intervention to configure ULA precedence will be needed. I still find that
> unsatisfactory, since the idea was always that unplanned merges might
> happen (in unmanaged networks, not in enterprise networks). If we decide to
> leave that unsolved, I think we'll be back to this problem later.
>
> Now as to how to fix this without a global precedence for ULAs, I am
> wondering about a PIO with L=0 and A=0 (exactly as recommended in RFC 8028,
> but for other reasons). If a host sees such a PIO for a ULA prefix, it
> could serve as a signal that the prefix is to be given a suitable
> precedence, even though it is not on-link and not used for SLAAC.
>
> (Credit where credit is due: Ted Lemon suggested this.)


I’ve been thinking that either a PIO or a RIO from within fc00::/7 should
trigger an entry in the table. If the prefix in the PIO or RIO is longer
than /48, the covering /48 should be added to the table. Otherwise, if the
prefix is /48 or shorter the prefix should be added to the table as-is. In
most case unless a PIO is a /64 it will likely have L=0 and A=0.

While probably not recommended, it would be possible for a network operator
to signal the entire ULA range as being local, using a PIO for fc00::/7
with L=0 and A=0, for example.

Finally, there should probably be a short discussion of managing the table,
such as removing an entry when the PIO is no longer valid and similarly for
a RIO.

Thanks
-- 
===============================================
David Farmer               Email:farmer@umn.edu
Networking & Telecommunication Services
Office of Information Technology
University of Minnesota
2218 University Ave SE        Phone: 612-626-0815
Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029   Cell: 612-812-9952
===============================================