Re: Proposal: Run QUIC over DTLS

Leif Hedstrom <> Wed, 07 March 2018 18:21 UTC

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Subject: Re: Proposal: Run QUIC over DTLS
From: Leif Hedstrom <>
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Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2018 10:21:28 -0800
Cc: Ted Hardie <>, Eric Rescorla <>, "" <>
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To: Martin Duke <>
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> On Mar 6, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Martin Duke <> wrote:
> I like the QUIC-over-DTLS architecture, and if it had come out a year ago, I might have been a supporter. However, I think the idea that we could possibly stay on schedule with this change is a fantasy.
> 1. For all its problems, the QUIC handshake is one thing that pretty much all the implementations have working. We've overcome the design inelegance, and would now have to redo the handshake without really reducing implementation time going forward, with the possible exception of not needing to handle key phase.
> 2. DTLS 1.3 is apparently less mature, as a standard, than TLS1.3, and even less so if we're about to go add a bunch of requirements.

This was my initial reaction as well. TLS v1.3 being such a moving target for the last ~12 months has been one of the biggest challenges to QUIC interop / development. I don’t know what state the various TLS implementations are for DTLS v1.3, but I’d be concerned that we start that circus up all over again.

I think assessing the state of DTLS v1.3 specifications and implementations is critical before making a technical decision. [I’m saying this with very little knowledge of the DTLS v1.3 world :-].


— Leif