Re: [v6ops] IPv6 mostly for DS-Lite

Ole Troan <otroan@employees.org> Wed, 20 March 2024 08:02 UTC

Return-Path: <otroan@employees.org>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EB11C1D4CE7 for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 20 Mar 2024 01:02:56 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -7.107
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.107 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=employees.org
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eUH81Nvucjqr for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 20 Mar 2024 01:02:52 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from proxmox01.kjsl.com (proxmox01.kjsl.com [IPv6:2607:7c80:54:6::6]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4469FC1D621A for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 20 Mar 2024 01:02:21 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from proxmox01.kjsl.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by proxmox01.kjsl.com (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 6F26AE1BD8; Wed, 20 Mar 2024 08:02:20 +0000 (UTC)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=employees.org; h=cc:cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:content-type :date:from:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:subject:subject:to:to; s=prox2023; bh=ztR6dw6ctAKRadIY bEitgUO8qLm5rCl9nGK/cBgYF7I=; b=iQ3WrCQeq393/gtk1xOiMPgNV8jYIQGP osTzbosWfY6FYOefQ05fr3BAY6sDmiY/Ly1pzoVzcnmlxJrzv7UiD9VZa9whqJMv a4exbTBvyOj1Xf8UB7Cbz0gA3aM435KqTctLhnit08PTVy5o9Z0kgdFUQKkeM7E7 6j3s72s59i7oimY0kBM5kLXEhshY3rVGxo4yLDL8h7nQBcj8K0GrGYqRcqM0ScRR 2BcFjss/Dfg6NgT7g29QxYQGnocS7O/COzpLp3e3HFv9Qq0h2fPkGftcJzqKqsOh 3WgDm4BaMsiLEGx/bignhPbS0KvGwYsn6nMfMu1f/1PdkRXGpL30Aw==
Received: from clarinet.employees.org (clarinet.employees.org [198.137.202.74]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by proxmox01.kjsl.com (Proxmox) with ESMTPS id 5095AE1BD1; Wed, 20 Mar 2024 08:02:20 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [IPv6:2a02:2121:608:79b9:41fb:84f6:3e5e:9044]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-ECDSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by clarinet.employees.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 863104E11BDA; Wed, 20 Mar 2024 08:02:19 +0000 (UTC)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.500.171.1.1\))
From: Ole Troan <otroan@employees.org>
In-Reply-To: <DDC693C6-632D-4B62-A812-906158DBE23C@isc.org>
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2024 09:02:07 +0100
Cc: Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo@google.com>, v6ops <v6ops@ietf.org>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <B67CE138-DFA7-40D9-ABC5-38405CCDD3C1@employees.org>
References: <CAKD1Yr3V7h-=CUP-m8fLwN7DSyMixmRyNixer++hAN61iwN1cQ@mail.gmail.com> <DDC693C6-632D-4B62-A812-906158DBE23C@isc.org>
To: Mark Andrews <marka@isc.org>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.500.171.1.1)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/L4Hu27qvl2IV65hU1AwjM2iXRZQ>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] IPv6 mostly for DS-Lite
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2024 08:02:56 -0000

Mark,

> Well people do use DS-Lite. Why should the be treated as second class citizens.

I’m afraid this is a VHS vs Betamax incidence.
DS-lite with a single NAT + tunnel + NAT64 is the better solution.
But 464XLAT won the market. Even with 3 NATs in a row. So that’s what we are going with.

I think it’s more important that we have a single solution, than that we have the best one.

Cheers,
Ole