IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [irsg] Follow up on disruptive person during IETF 119

Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@gmail.com> Fri, 22 March 2024 03:22 UTC

Return-Path: <melinda.shore@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: wgchairs@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: wgchairs@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3E02C14F61F; Thu, 21 Mar 2024 20:22:48 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -7.108
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.108 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VdcFM6UKzD6a; Thu, 21 Mar 2024 20:22:48 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-oi1-x22e.google.com (mail-oi1-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::22e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 36A17C14F60D; Thu, 21 Mar 2024 20:22:48 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-oi1-x22e.google.com with SMTP id 5614622812f47-3bbc649c275so924098b6e.0; Thu, 21 Mar 2024 20:22:48 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1711077767; x=1711682567; darn=ietf.org; h=in-reply-to:autocrypt:from:references:cc:to:content-language :subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=NbFvVd/vBGlwM8pCVUrEdFeY7oMOxrOdVjzdTLscOPU=; b=STC/13UVpdWPpeVdMWvRsaisWel6yeSLzMFceox/3cOAottigWHcFG2vn0mfJgtsoY b9NIPtt3Kw8vH4G/DrxYjU9NJaU2daNnjavlT6xMc8T2gJT8roXCAZ+qxWV5emE3+1xr RxCFzFfoDCkdNp/iN2SBFzqf+tS6y6c4lIbvAVAm5wjNo/ZjT6SN+0sWA+iZvb6KYhDj 6kIxFilojHjsJTlEjZHKZN4cidVm2CNIb8HIJzR3n6BKTnPSYnNS5/1WXvat7bD39R0A lfy64mnnIiy9xFWetCBld2Ii2XINMHtjxhaofe6eXuaSuBVCYvbf0lPywt72zTVsaoiA bKpg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1711077767; x=1711682567; h=in-reply-to:autocrypt:from:references:cc:to:content-language :subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id:x-gm-message-state :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=NbFvVd/vBGlwM8pCVUrEdFeY7oMOxrOdVjzdTLscOPU=; b=MXfsqSA95hpC2xdtzJYR1ZvJra1WP5LjSeN7vYsFyVSTsFjvokpINJiHk0pO2gT6We Zwf2JFTOenbnnPmG40HLPE2lymTYEJpztmrA6lx29ialU/Q/vzaRWFL2dN8EmWJK0Od5 dVFLoiRCq7JAy2bIdWAN/K/QHdAVzOeEk+kdjSySbkRV1ELxXXShSokzBt1Xnq49taQE Ci/cL2HIf+uUKUrqLCGIkyKjyRVOhgc3NxJfmEAKgnBFftzagwLsKTkIjDssH2+HpIPf 31MG9xXcAxo8V2Sl77emaspftmYAAG4lKOEHBXyU2eojsD2yRjHn9flheZv3hpyVc3Yx uFuw==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yz3NQvvHupxkvq2L19V5ri4DhaAjZWtssuEvMhHQcnV5vRAXw+E eQslmj9rvsrV0UP7nKAEzEJBW+6jUuHtW7nTpmzEFzsUqNA+fs8gPdYm38PJ
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IG1CkdAiXqDbyu9tede3YJm31njyDqYfsHQFWovJ2KHOVE3QsKR/drXLEmG6Tl65Qt+riOM6g==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:bc9:b0:3c1:ee17:c5cc with SMTP id o9-20020a0568080bc900b003c1ee17c5ccmr1442768oik.19.1711077767221; Thu, 21 Mar 2024 20:22:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.1.111] ([63.140.70.76]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v12-20020aa799cc000000b006e64baac744sm599215pfi.120.2024.03.21.20.22.46 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 21 Mar 2024 20:22:46 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <1847a775-0ddd-4c88-a519-0e0feaedd20b@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2024 19:22:45 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Subject: Re: [irsg] Follow up on disruptive person during IETF 119
Content-Language: en-US
To: Jay Daley <exec-director@ietf.org>, "irsg@irtf.org Steering Group" <irsg@irtf.org>
Cc: IETF WG Chairs <wgchairs@ietf.org>, team@meetecho.com, Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com>
References: <5F30A325-7A57-49C5-8FD9-B23ADE8D155B@ietf.org> <CAL02cgRRhZFDFWxUAOSOkku-+soo5bQZmx44a2fh5dXpO3F4kQ@mail.gmail.com> <5079FA08-FF4D-47F2-BE83-41527654B1DC@ietf.org>
From: Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@gmail.com>
Autocrypt: addr=melinda.shore@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBFppZ0gBEADFwxAi5szDOsM/6+CH4pbYTX7D+2gjLY4xEE7ydQcAF1WVLvcWXrpZM0GO /eA4N1PJ+OT5o8o9zVr7izMJkiLwcnQmxHdlYgZ9E+Cm8hDtMyEPBQwsYTkE5kpbGCmBAZ+W rHNHjvDg366uZQHzJejenB1/V4+rxMZs1Ak34Az2MVOz9Doecaiadpw3NpH3+1VXY/qilqnM lznINSANqD0ktxB/CVKjxl3/K5JnVnLp0h2kiUqt19hQPX2JmLcgaHzu+Ceb34/HZWhs0CiF c4auhQ3A9PcccOprQh6IGW1xo6RP3OEbeRFqeovgBWS+DIWzMIM0a3G2LDid0889QYwEv0zZ RPDCcF3g15mlkeUUmwKQ6eAagPyTqLtTiOKULqy9bQahyX2eqlySrF+HqlwGeNoG+A4l1Z2Y S7NCBLPIzUk2RuSKMBaKw86ORzvg2Advrw4bdv7kbDkArGzywky61SEB/q+GqR466mekXx2F O+m8RuoSnWrBsKvD/bhELHcneorIBleGz+VL7i5adU0rIydG3jPTfUeXoCZIeNx1LannxnAR ihKdh5+FE26WiiK6VmZWkvFjaPFwWGjvAsi82Pd9QgHhnG/XzINpXw/3HF4wtBTU5nIExMzC +FbJxCPq1kXpqSxJqg7hgUFvD5jUD9lpN5Br/S2dUgJj95bbPQARAQABzSdNZWxpbmRhIFNo b3JlIDxtZWxpbmRhLnNob3JlQGdtYWlsLmNvbT7CwZcEEwEKAEECGwMFCQ2IJAUFCwkIBwMF FQoJCAsFFgIDAQACHgECF4AWIQRPaC2TKheW+CDyNMDfuJFymnbbjwUCZDxTTQIZAQAKCRDf uJFymnbbj6yfEACUfz4mrChuQ7tP8krkkp6LJt6yqS6Ht7m0AMLGfOe/TLv5/g2Bbv4GuRVs 3YCyYwbSQkTdDe5c2aQQCNCogbGGHlhuZaBrDwcBwsBP75RgLEVDOHz8FGlE6MtAO9T4iJIW idzyh5ikZg+rtvFcrpfP5AITf+nWLDG0QUCzAewyognQuPdhMDYZtz7XZWV7s6zMrIDNlejl IlvERzYB5uCTC2tmx1b4kzx49XP4aEm+iAD7CrKHNr5TWiihi2lgmHPXuMJQfLpVBl9BvRi1 1iwt9Uz0DtSUAoafHs4fjq1IV/hzfoBvh7OrdLFpWxrun8dkIAC2HjZYYIYpRBez066Q/Z67 8kkdCPaTwJn8Rb/PLjVq3cJe2MrfcyumoB9Nhw14Ko0QIZGbvEEieRNwwHryNv5UTOzPAo2J 9kJOc4Y1IQsTVEhKS+IhLrCXDAvMjbYn9WRvXo+yPzEGDQVvMQOQPIDyPJmZs5OQ46McdMov sfYT4o82qvRDZ/6tfrKcrnhdMbKnodc/e+QfD2+6P7zw5tVZVPC87DYCvxwK3mvnN4/du2fQ g/9sX/FhY2tQysivSooGeZSXSiRwHz31M+OSh+nSFd21jhZ6IeV/xlVFMLHTCmmpdq3PS8gQ JsVIDKD/xyPraTOgU5q2o1kepYVb18FvQT7eCZwo5vS53ZmfRM7BTQRaaWdIARAAoGbjNfII c0robr/p9JFslgnhFq8fRMtNxIBY+WpQbeefji793TrHcgRycY7XdHGUtV2imZYK9WGdDqUD b/1ssvLkltgWeochtUijff9TJnySzZ448WgUD+MmjMA3Ut8F+4aFmNfSKVT2R2A0d+RQIEpx v7OsHviDiEzNUyaDibOPsoHiuXQuy30aI/pZBB2K03IJWFbsLMithTc/7BfJCVtXxGRzOuqY Um4Qr8GxAlm2+Hgxl2ymWPdltUU0OVObXfAzC18mIqUKYa3KHkV6W9fA2zpxNFsCEFdMgYHP 604lLf8FY2rHdUa7AjwUAv7ifmR5J769jKMSFgQbEbSmBxuumji/pw1fF9Zorheo+HM7b4Jn aq8Dx6QClcYX8HfxuLLjQbp2MOP5AFfW9vnonV+XptzbTzzZf6jY7JhB0Bp/+SSkR0b0LNMr ooFw4TdjdJHqB62xghPJMgP3fNy+xPXfeYbH9ycaUc5nmk83vjaXCGl+bl3SjmggYy7cdbTq wwOF1+2N52PsGimWGt0bwu8rpRSYin2Fg0q4lnkF3F49OqfB+rxerMvS3l/cUUY0yO6gxxcc LjECChqoLn17cbtKccXDKl0xFD2Z8VFlL7hY42LxJrTvdvjrfzbqLVfCb0T8INjp2IzCaHVN V+4cxLPHY7YGRvrdxRBit4tRCVEAEQEAAcLBfAQYAQoAJhYhBE9oLZMqF5b4IPI0wN+4kXKa dtuPBQJkPFNNAhsMBQkNiCQFAAoJEN+4kXKadtuPbw4P/3XswONGyZL4hyczKAI8FpwFM8cH Chgw6N0qG80KbG/yWewJimXKvpqoROrOd5AHJDco38/FIPMOlz+wno0UV2+VLDyHabGPhwll oyJ1aOz92gDu7KZYMaAN99BmmDeCztaxLDlvWqU4YCTInNY4d2nGPQMVNY5X0IAOkG19iY7m TOaYZ2K702cgIHmB2gO+EJdyzjDhv2AJUOYMOrSzL9zb2jVo88PmVfLg/CNuoiG6/pjVR3ri 67EhxeQuuakyMd6aHX9WQwtPTPXVJXQI1zQ2hQ0deS3Hfa+thMmOvuTm4QxKMB8ZV59/sg2H EUhiptaJQCgO49Qh9RrIpi3SoWmIM9euBOQPLkmOSSY4zp0GepYMEcvS5RD7dn5Ayi/16iG6 EzndvD2SpulH+6+Eo5cxM7h9cuF3qyXTNDKDZASAGvqetHpl2pJMbVN4ltnmJJ46P0h9H0gH OLZmKTowdWI9YHfgg0z+SvvKI9xHAjuPsntitpC7yiYS/FuUTHI0yiSkvPjMUzNUgmUg1ZSI kgakEpvJIpeIUfVJ5228Dh3x5eZdsHmOMcvD5ubmtj21fLnU6vOQhbwvb3gVVafBpFci04ZK LFOttBd4+3kjA1pykXIbKRH1pbvpZ5Tf7xl+/YfTNUwyBxcQwpAJMyyvbjN3wBIRD9DwxYSH iGfPgwFv
In-Reply-To: <5079FA08-FF4D-47F2-BE83-41527654B1DC@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha256"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------N8qIb6u3UG0JKdbokdZ2A9WQ"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/wgchairs/CIkeqjrCZr-jQc41pvoR43YRXh8>
X-BeenThere: wgchairs@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: Working Group Chairs <wgchairs.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/wgchairs>, <mailto:wgchairs-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/wgchairs/>
List-Post: <mailto:wgchairs@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:wgchairs-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/wgchairs>, <mailto:wgchairs-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2024 03:22:48 -0000

On 3/21/24 5:25 PM, Jay Daley wrote:
> 2.  We’ve operated in a particular way for quite some time and this is 
> first real issue we’ve had. Extrapolating from this to regular 
> disruption is taking things too far.

I think that's correct.  Also, I've watched the video of the plenary
and haven't seen the other sessions that were disrupted, but
what I saw in the plenary looked clueless rather than malicious.
The individual in question appeared to be a first-time
participant, and it seems to me that if someone were feeling
up to it it might not be a terrible idea to get in touch with
this person, ask them if they're planning to continue to
participate, and talk to them about IETF process.  They can't
be allowed to disrupt meetings but otherwise a little forbearance
seems appropriate[*[.

Melinda

[*] Acknowledging, of course, that if that behavior continued
all week and after repeated warnings, then there's a problem
beyond just not knowing how the IETF works.

-- 
Melinda Shore
melinda.shore@gmail.com

Software longa, hardware brevis

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email