Re: [hybi] WebSockets feedback

Greg Wilkins <gregw@webtide.com> Thu, 15 April 2010 07:02 UTC

Return-Path: <gregw@webtide.com>
X-Original-To: hybi@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: hybi@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A9AE3A695D for <hybi@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 15 Apr 2010 00:02:08 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.001
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iLo8whie3TLd for <hybi@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 15 Apr 2010 00:02:07 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-bw0-f225.google.com (mail-bw0-f225.google.com [209.85.218.225]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E1163A6B4F for <hybi@ietf.org>; Thu, 15 Apr 2010 00:01:57 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by bwz25 with SMTP id 25so1081224bwz.28 for <hybi@ietf.org>; Thu, 15 Apr 2010 00:01:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.204.39.206 with SMTP id h14mr9726461bke.50.1271314907230; Thu, 15 Apr 2010 00:01:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.0.100] (host116-234-static.43-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it [88.43.234.116]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 16sm946277bwz.5.2010.04.15.00.01.45 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Thu, 15 Apr 2010 00:01:46 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <4BC6B9D6.6090100@webtide.com>
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2010 09:01:42 +0200
From: Greg Wilkins <gregw@webtide.com>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.24 (X11/20100411)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Hybi <hybi@ietf.org>
References: <B578CFED7FE85644A170F4F7C9D52692019544C5@ESESSCMS0361.eemea.ericsson.se> <3d5f2a811003150230sdeb4f78hbdece96e5c742cfc@mail.gmail.com> <de17d48e1003180316w3dda1a3fo7db8b357925ec3f8@mail.gmail.com> <p2o3d5f2a811003310031x5dce7e9cs86a5a8981cd23c1d@mail.gmail.com> <Pine.LNX.4.64.1004140032040.875@ps20323.dreamhostps.com>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.64.1004140032040.875@ps20323.dreamhostps.com>
X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [hybi] WebSockets feedback
X-BeenThere: hybi@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Server-Initiated HTTP <hybi.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/hybi>
List-Post: <mailto:hybi@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2010 07:02:08 -0000

Ian Hickson wrote:
>> Examples that come to mind include:
>>
>>   Browser implementing a simple multiplexing standard
>>   to make all websockets from the same tab/window share
>>   a common connection.
>>
>>   Browser implementing compression.
> 
> Why wouldn't we just build these straight into the Web Socket spec? 
> Surely if browsers just implement their own random extensions, it would
> only be for experimentation, since it wouldn't have a chance to
> interoperate with other browsers and servers.


Ian,

\O/  That's is exactly what we've been trying to tell you for many
many months - if not years!    These kinds of concerns are of
prime consideration for this working group and cannot be dismissed
as something the application developer will write.

These sorts of things must be part of the standards process,
either as:

  + part of the base protocol
  + as an extension/subprotocol/layer to the base protocol (but part of this spec)
  + as an extension/subprotocol/layer to the base protocol (but part of another spec)
  + as part of a future version of the protocol


As for the rest of your long feedback email, much of it appears
to be going over ground that we've gone over many times before.
I don't think such discussions will every resolve until we
have a clear statement of requirements in which to evaluate
various arguments.

Hopefully we can soon pick up on the momentum for that
generated at the 77 meeting.

regards