Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt> (The "safe" HTTP Preference) to Proposed Standard
Joseph Lorenzo Hall <joe@cdt.org> Tue, 18 November 2014 17:09 UTC
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Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2014 12:09:39 -0500
From: Joseph Lorenzo Hall <joe@cdt.org>
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To: John Levine <johnl@taugh.com>, ietf@ietf.org
Subject: Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt> (The "safe" HTTP Preference) to Proposed Standard
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 11/14/14, 4:31 PM, John Levine wrote: >> One could even imagine "Safe" becoming a default setting. > > The last time we beat this horse, one of the scenarios was that a > browser in a public setting or an institution's proxy server might > set it on. > > Remember that these setups are already heavily filtered, so the > alternative to "safe" content from a site is not all content, it's > no content at all. Hmmm, perhaps my experience with filtering technologies is different from yours, but they have more nobs than just domain blocking. Part of the argument we are making (sorry if it was unclear) and that Yoav has spent a few messages on this thread trying to get across is that it's critical that there be a common understanding of what "safe" means for this to be useful to parents, guardians, or other folks that may want to interact with the internet in a "safe" manner. Each of the sites that have implemented this have different interpretations of the content filtering they do upon receipt of this flag and we can't count on browsers to be able to mediate that knowledge without a richer standard (and likely some interactivity in the technical expression of this preference, which if you follow DNT at W3C (or any other interactive granular content negotiations a la PICS) is a bear). best, Joe - -- Joseph Lorenzo Hall Chief Technologist Center for Democracy & Technology 1634 I ST NW STE 1100 Washington DC 20006-4011 (p) 202-407-8825 (f) 202-637-0968 joe@cdt.org PGP: https://josephhall.org/gpg-key fingerprint: 3CA2 8D7B 9F6D DBD3 4B10 1607 5F86 6987 40A9 A871 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.13 (Darwin) iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJUa31TAAoJEF+GaYdAqahxyz8P/1+LufrCyVaAzuynHByJv5Za jm7k5R/7TenOIzqjejsQ8SComeojzxGOzAKrY9IUZBhS5RH4WXl3w6mDJIioWi6v mKdSNbrQQZlYvBD6+hMDSX240HDrWDmTUoJzhV4134VebkQAhJS/9VHqbsd/Z2Tp PSfHMopqC0BR4+pSY5/y6xEfnhlnpjgBA3LAn9gyWoJ4EYEHmVZKQ8wW18SYO8/R cgqmHE7A0waION7pBNNh9MX1s/K3ikHLkVuUQ4cSKjv8fKNXj6YQZpiRvmbSmdE6 ikGaZeUxlrfujtSRl3T5M9Mpf7ZdsyIWPUCTnJhP2b9Krx8n7KvulsldRu/4WyyB Ln4W1jF3h7NRh1CQjQc6ycq67z/sGtkl1tYBa1i02an6BUwBfxopDZaMMpecH1+o C3DmB/xy8IazxYEeYLfDTZaQvv7sFgZOO6EEU2EHH4s3Jlzr+ov6mhK08Hv27/X+ C+NTFqwZjLt6rRLQlSpoutRFc1oZG0sLfM+0J4pXRdlQN3ule522SWzJad2Fi2xQ 9T12iVS8RlZ1p9aj5W0UFH9ukGVkY4+A5pXzLls4JnVpDXCfiGJw5KQ/ojveqphl sAS3lqZ31FYeOXGpyTSKZknoaRdMdF+YNptmbPbqzXTg+sG9Hjr+gc3XkITh9HbZ 21Buhv2EycKNuZQK7/qR =pQ/w -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Stephen Farrell
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Donald Eastlake
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Mark Nottingham
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Mark Nottingham
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Donald Eastlake
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… S Moonesamy
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Mark Nottingham
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Mark Nottingham
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… ned+ietf
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… t.p.
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Eliot Lear
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Andrew Newton
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Stephen Farrell
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… ned+ietf
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Andrew Sullivan
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… ned+ietf
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Stephen Farrell
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Randy Bush
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… S Moonesamy
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… joel jaeggli
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Paul Hoffman
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Paul Hoffman
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Barry Leiba
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Eliot Lear
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… joel jaeggli
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Lloyd Wood
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- RE: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Christian Huitema
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Stephen Farrell
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Dave Crocker
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Doug Barton
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Yoav Nir
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John R Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Mark Nottingham
- RE: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Christian Huitema
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Doug Barton
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Mark Nottingham
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Eliot Lear
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Doug Barton
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… joel jaeggli
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Eliot Lear
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… John R Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-nottingham-safe-hint-05.txt… Bjoern Hoehrmann