Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ?
Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> Tue, 10 April 2012 17:00 UTC
Return-Path: <robert@raszuk.net>
X-Original-To: sidr@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: sidr@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D203011E8102 for <sidr@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 10 Apr 2012 10:00:39 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lcUtESGrAsVj for <sidr@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 10 Apr 2012 10:00:39 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail1310.opentransfer.com (mail1310.opentransfer.com [76.162.254.103]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1701A11E80F3 for <sidr@ietf.org>; Tue, 10 Apr 2012 10:00:39 -0700 (PDT)
Received: (qmail 31084 invoked by uid 399); 10 Apr 2012 17:00:38 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.1.57?) (pbs:robert@raszuk.net@83.31.51.142) by mail1310.opentransfer.com with ESMTPM; 10 Apr 2012 17:00:38 -0000
X-Originating-IP: 83.31.51.142
Message-ID: <4F846736.2060604@raszuk.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2012 19:00:38 +0200
From: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:11.0) Gecko/20120312 Thunderbird/11.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Christopher Morrow <morrowc.lists@gmail.com>
References: <D7A0423E5E193F40BE6E94126930C4930B96182E71@MBCLUSTER.xchange.nist.gov> <4F828D6D.10907@raszuk.net> <D7A0423E5E193F40BE6E94126930C4930B96C507DA@MBCLUSTER.xchange.nist.gov> <4F830E75.70606@raszuk.net> <24B20D14B2CD29478C8D5D6E9CBB29F60F6F1533@Hermes.columbia.ads.sparta.com> <4F832F5E.9030903@raszuk.net> <0BD03B75-CA3A-4CBA-BBF4-E2100AFA64E4@kumari.net> <4F846121.2050408@raszuk.net> <CAL9jLaYF-MW1cJ2n28BiV1mi+tpPS2ECKB2UxhFMQ=NXxbihCg@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAL9jLaYF-MW1cJ2n28BiV1mi+tpPS2ECKB2UxhFMQ=NXxbihCg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Cc: "idr@ietf.org List" <idr@ietf.org>, sidr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ?
X-BeenThere: sidr@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
Reply-To: robert@raszuk.net
List-Id: Secure Interdomain Routing <sidr.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/sidr>, <mailto:sidr-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/sidr>
List-Post: <mailto:sidr@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:sidr-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sidr>, <mailto:sidr-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2012 17:00:40 -0000
> So... we can send the data along, but in the case of BGPSEC speakers > the data isn't used (it's replicated in the BGPSEC_SIGNED_PATH). So far I have always heard that BGPSEC is just providing the hint to the operator and does not change how BGP works. Here you are saying that now AS_PATH length should be calculated from completely different (and optional) attribute. You are also saying that now multipath code which computes which path are eligible to be multipath needs to look/parse/decrypt totally different attribute. All BGP monitoring tools need to be upgraded to now understand BGPSEC attribute too. And surprise .. here BMP will not convert it like it will to "legacy" speakers. You may think that if we stuff all "data" in the new attribute and drop the other one everything else will work. This may be so in theory, but it is clearly not a case in practice. Regards, R. > On Tue, Apr 10, 2012 at 12:34 PM, Robert Raszuk<robert@raszuk.net> wrote: >> Anyhow my doubt has been answered and I stay by my opinion that not sending >> AS_PATH and AS4_PATH is a terrible idea. > > So... we can send the data along, but in the case of BGPSEC speakers > the data isn't used (it's replicated in the BGPSEC_SIGNED_PATH). > Carrying extra bits isn't actually helpful is it? (the implementers > drove the design decision here I believe) > >> Perhaps one could depreciate it in 20 years when world is upgraded to >> BGPSEC, but recommending this in BGPSEC protocol draft now is IMHO not >> helpful for any even potential BGPSEC deployment model. > > is it helpful for the folks that write bgp code though? "Hey, you will > need to re-synthesize the as-path at sec->non-sec boundaries. you need > to also create sec-path at none->sec boundaries." > > -chris > >
- [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Path sh… Shane Amante
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Stephen Kent
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Shane Amante
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Jakob Heitz
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Andrew Chi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Shane Amante
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Andrew Chi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Shane Amante
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Murphy, Sandra
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Andrew Chi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Andrew Chi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Sriram, Kotikalapudi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Jakob Heitz
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Sriram, Kotikalapudi
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-0… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-0… Murphy, Sandra
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-0… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-0… Montgomery, Douglas
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-0… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-0… Murphy, Sandra
- [sidr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-0… Stephen Kent
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Stephen Kent
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-threats-02: Pat… Stephen Kent
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Warren Kumari
- Re: [sidr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Warren Kumari
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Montgomery, Douglas
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Jakob Heitz
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Jakob Heitz
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Randy Bush
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Randy Bush
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Paul Jakma
- [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deployment (w… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Jakob Heitz
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Brian Dickson
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? George, Wes
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… George, Wes
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? George, Wes
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Robert Raszuk
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? George, Wes
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] No BGPSEC intradomain ? Paul Jakma
- Re: [sidr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental deploymen… Jakob Heitz
- Re: [sidr] [Idr] iBGP, BGPSEC and incremental dep… Brian Dickson