Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI
"Salz, Rich" <rsalz@akamai.com> Tue, 13 May 2014 17:56 UTC
Return-Path: <rsalz@akamai.com>
X-Original-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 572561A011A for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 13 May 2014 10:56:25 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.551
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.551 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W-jflv8wMn-K for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 13 May 2014 10:56:23 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from prod-mail-xrelay07.akamai.com (prod-mail-xrelay07.akamai.com [72.246.2.115]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B80881A0160 for <tls@ietf.org>; Tue, 13 May 2014 10:56:23 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from prod-mail-xrelay07.akamai.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by postfix.imss70 (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30DA5475F5; Tue, 13 May 2014 17:56:17 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from prod-mail-relay07.akamai.com (unknown [172.17.121.112]) by prod-mail-xrelay07.akamai.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B864475EA; Tue, 13 May 2014 17:56:17 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from usma1ex-cashub.kendall.corp.akamai.com (usma1ex-cashub7.kendall.corp.akamai.com [172.27.105.23]) by prod-mail-relay07.akamai.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1821D80040; Tue, 13 May 2014 17:56:17 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from USMBX1.msg.corp.akamai.com ([169.254.1.79]) by usma1ex-cashub7.kendall.corp.akamai.com ([172.27.105.23]) with mapi; Tue, 13 May 2014 13:56:16 -0400
From: "Salz, Rich" <rsalz@akamai.com>
To: Daniel Kahn Gillmor <dkg@fifthhorseman.net>, Erik Nygren <erik+ietf@nygren.org>, Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net>
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 13:56:15 -0400
Thread-Topic: [TLS] About encrypting SNI
Thread-Index: Ac9u1Fhqg/nZx71GR2+ihfl84861aAAABLJg
Message-ID: <2A0EFB9C05D0164E98F19BB0AF3708C7130ABEA266@USMBX1.msg.corp.akamai.com>
References: <2A0EFB9C05D0164E98F19BB0AF3708C7120A04ED40@USMBX1.msg.corp.akamai.com> <534C3D5A.3020406@fifthhorseman.net> <474FAE5F-DE7D-4140-931E-409325168487@akamai.com> <D2CB0B72-A548-414C-A926-A9AA45B962DA@gmail.com> <2A0EFB9C05D0164E98F19BB0AF3708C7120B490162@USMBX1.msg.corp.akamai.com> <CACsn0cmusUc3Rsb2Wof+dn0PEg3P0bPC3ZdJ75b9kkZ5LDGu_A@mail.gmail.com> <534DB18A.4060408@mit.edu> <CABcZeBOJ7k8Hb9QqCAxJ_uev9g_cb4j361dp7ANvnhOOKsT7NA@mail.gmail.com> <CA+cU71kFo6EihTVUrRRtBYEHbZwCa9nZo-awt4Sub2qXcKHC7g@mail.gmail.com> <CAK3OfOi1x9huaazwcO=d72mfOFuV_RyXnfHmFRduhhbJE2miYw@mail.gmail.com> <CALCETrWukS2QJSb01n7OpXD2iaK43OhZr4E8YZyJ6JaorCdBKw@mail.gmail.com> <CAKC-DJjgFrAmxkC-MsmL+-uRWpN_mDPGkV_g-6DhbVH+69EQEQ@mail.gmail.com> <2A0EFB9C05D0164E98F19BB0AF3708C7130ABEA050@USMBX1.msg.corp.akamai.com> <53725C34.8060105@fifthhorseman.net>
In-Reply-To: <53725C34.8060105@fifthhorseman.net>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/IZ5w5uGbkxzYyM4M7RLsNkWa79k
Cc: "tls@ietf.org" <tls@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI
X-BeenThere: tls@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: "This is the mailing list for the Transport Layer Security working group of the IETF." <tls.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/tls>, <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/tls/>
List-Post: <mailto:tls@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tls>, <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 17:56:25 -0000
> The TLS WG needs to fix the SNI leak, and DNS confidentiality needs to be addressed by the DNS folks if we want to protect this information against passive eavesdropping. I've already written why I think encrypting SNI is not worth the trade-offs. Yoav, I think, added the point that the traffic analysis will give it away, anyway. It hurts more than it helps. /r$ -- Principal Security Engineer Akamai Technologies, Cambridge, MA IM: rsalz@jabber.me; Twitter: RichSalz
- [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Martin Thomson
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Russ Housley
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Brian Sniffen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Alyssa Rowan
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Nick Mathewson
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Daniel Kahn Gillmor
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Sniffen, Brian
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Yoav Nir
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Seth David Schoen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Nico Williams
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Yoav Nir
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Alyssa Rowan
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Martin Rex
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Tom Ritter
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Brian Sniffen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Brian Sniffen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Sniffen, Brian
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Alyssa Rowan
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Michael D'Errico
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI James Cloos
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Jacob Appelbaum
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Erik Nygren
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Jacob Appelbaum
- [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Alyssa Rowan
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Paul Lambert
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Erik Nygren
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Yoav Nir
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Sniffen, Brian
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Erik Nygren
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI James Cloos
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST Stephen Farrell
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Nico Williams
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Erik Nygren
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Sniffen, Brian
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Martin Thomson
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Brian Sniffen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Sniffen, Brian
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Erik Nygren
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Bill Frantz
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Yoav Nir
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Bill Frantz
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] Forged RST (was: About encrypting SNI) Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Marsh Ray
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Martin Rex
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI David Holmes
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Brian Sniffen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Marsh Ray
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Marsh Ray
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Nico Williams
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Michael D'Errico
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Erik Nygren
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Daniel Kahn Gillmor
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI - Traffic Analysis… Michael StJohns
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI - Traffic Analysis… Nico Williams
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI - Traffic Analysis… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI - Traffic Analysis… Martin Rex
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Nikos Mavrogiannopoulos
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Stephen Farrell
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI - Traffic Analysis… Martin Thomson
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI - Traffic Analysis… Tom Ritter
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Brian Sniffen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Fabrice
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Jacob Appelbaum
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Paul Lambert
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Yoav Nir
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Daniel Kahn Gillmor
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Tim Bray
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Jacob Appelbaum
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Paul Hoffman
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Brian Sniffen
- Re: [TLS] About encrypting SNI Yoav Nir