Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting deadlines for the IESG and the community
Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> Sun, 17 March 2024 20:35 UTC
Return-Path: <cabo@tzi.org>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A467EC14F60C for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 17 Mar 2024 13:35:16 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.909
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.909 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MgE7R7K9ofGV for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 17 Mar 2024 13:35:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ACCEBC14F601 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Sun, 17 Mar 2024 13:35:12 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.10.115] (unknown [202.4.29.216]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4TyV9711RpzDCbW; Sun, 17 Mar 2024 21:35:06 +0100 (CET)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\))
Subject: Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting deadlines for the IESG and the community
From: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
In-Reply-To: <8746156f-905b-03de-b95a-cfdb10ca9fcd@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2024 06:35:03 +1000
Cc: "Murray S. Kucherawy" <superuser@gmail.com>, Pete Resnick <resnick@episteme.net>, John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>, Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com>, ietf@ietf.org
X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 732400503.112258-7c5b7d6f9edf6246c39ea4616920eb44
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <EE62CF5F-1554-4143-933C-523319B4C073@tzi.org>
References: <7826C4F13FA874CD79459A4B@PSB> <65A7921B-2A05-439A-976C-226560C5E7F4@strayalpha.com> <e0702d8a-cea5-4928-b571-98442ccd4f29@petit-huguenin.org> <6d0c6b07-2fc3-496c-ba66-dc40cbf46df8@dfn.de> <69EE71C9-C42B-49A6-BC0D-508F799DB68E@tzi.org> <1d301b86-c994-4a9c-810c-9a42e12a0ad8@network-heretics.com> <53C617FA98D84931861C1F59@PSB> <85D994BF-5E89-437B-821C-12DE93C403B3@episteme.net> <CAL0qLwYba_V4VHABRuSLybG0d5-XW2onOjab3vxsf-H2dnYWNw@mail.gmail.com> <8746156f-905b-03de-b95a-cfdb10ca9fcd@gmail.com>
To: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/QDB9oxSfK6NhSRZR5QZK7xcqhcw>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: "IETF-Discussion. This is the most general IETF mailing list, intended for discussion of technical, procedural, operational, and other topics for which no dedicated mailing lists exist." <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2024 20:35:16 -0000
On 2024-03-18, at 04:56, Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> wrote: > > You said (the context is below): > >> Doesn't matter what's said on the list, the document in the tracker is the source of truth; > > I don't see why it isn't equally true that: > > "Doesn't matter what's said on github, the document in the tracker is the source of truth" > > because that's a matter of definition - the most recently published draft *is* the draft. github is just a manifestation of a formal or de facto design team. We've had design teams and off-list discussions for decades. This. I’ve sometimes run into people who think we first need to establish working group consensus to merge a PR (*). WG chairs are of course free to set up rules like that, but then I think we don’t even need working group consensus to submit an updated I-D — that is exactly done so we have an efficient way to check whether the working group agrees with the direction proposed by the I-D authors. But again, please talk to your WG chairs about how your WG handles this; e.g., the WG may have an “implementation draft” label that it only gives to I-Ds after a mini-WGLC (which probably will allow open issues), with more sketchy drafts interspersed. Grüße, Carsten (*): It is not particularly bright to merge a PR that has significant opposition, but here “rough consensus” may apply. If you don’t like what your authors are doing, ask the chairs to find better ones, it is in their remit to make such decisions.
- Question about pre-meeting document posting deadl… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… touch@strayalpha.com
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Marc Petit-Huguenin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Pete Resnick
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Benoit Claise
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Salz, Rich
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Pete Resnick
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… George Michaelson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Jan-Frederik Rieckers
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… touch@strayalpha.com
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Michael Richardson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Pete Resnick
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Pete Resnick
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Martin J. Dürst
- Rule of removing adopted work (was Re: Question a… Abdussalam Baryun
- RE: Rule of removing adopted work (was Re: Questi… Adrian Farrel
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Rule of removing adopted work (was Re: Questi… Keith Moore
- Re: Rule of removing adopted work (was Re: Questi… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… S Moonesamy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Michael Richardson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Pete Resnick
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… S Moonesamy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Pete Resnick
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… S Moonesamy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Lloyd W
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… S Moonesamy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Michael Richardson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Michael Richardson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Michael Richardson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Salz, Rich
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Benson Muite
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Salz, Rich
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… touch@strayalpha.com
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… touch@strayalpha.com
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Michael Richardson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Eliot Lear
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Rob Wilton (rwilton)
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Michael Richardson
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… John C Klensin
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… Keith Moore
- Re: Question about pre-meeting document posting d… S Moonesamy