Re: Challenge: was Re: Updated Nomcom 2020-2021: Result of random selection process

[Yoav Nir <[e-mail]>]

WARNING: RFC lawyering follows.

I’m not sure I agree.  Two paragraphs in section 4.17 of RFC 7437 govern this.

The first is the second paragraph:

   No more than two volunteers with the same primary affiliation may be
   selected for the nominating committee.  The Chair reviews the primary
   affiliation of each volunteer selected by the method in turn.  If the
   primary affiliation for a volunteer is the same as two previously
   selected volunteers, that volunteer is removed from consideration and
   the method is repeated to identify the next eligible volunteer.

Clearly this is the procedure for the chair to follow if she detects that the list contains more than two people with the same affiliation. This is the procedure that was followed to remove Reshad Rahman, but note that the RFC does not call this being disqualified; just “removed from consideration”.  This was not what happened with the Huawei candidates. In that case, the relevant paragraph is the sixth paragraph:

   If a selected volunteer, upon reading the announcement with the list
   of selected volunteers, finds that two or more other volunteers have
   the same affiliation, then the volunteer should notify the Chair who
   will determine the appropriate action.

This puts the determination of how to proceed in the hands of the chair.  She is not required to roll back the clock to simulate a situation in which Luigi Iannone had filled in the volunteer form correctly. I believe she has made such a determination, and has acted within the mandate of RFC 7437.

Yoav

> On 10 Jul 2020, at 19:04, Michael StJohns <[e-mail]> wrote:
> 
> Hi - 
> 
> I hate to do this, but I'm going to be challenging this particular outcome as it isn't strictly following the rules - basically, Luigi may not be replaced by Tal.  He either serves, or if he declines to serve, the next person on the list - not Tal - will be selected.
> 
> Here's my reasoning:
> 
> After Luigi belatedly indicated his association with Huawei, the defined process results in him remaining on the list but Tal being disqualified (as there being 2 previous Huawei people selected before him).   If Luigi - at a later time - decided he couldn't serve, we don't reach back on the list for the previously disqualified people, we look forward - e.g. Tal once disqualfied is no longer a candidate for future pulls.  If the next selected (#13 I think) is Huawei, they could serve as Luigi's departure would move the Huawei count back down to 1.
> 
> The whole idea of this random draw is that people can't pick and choose to substitute someone else for themselves.  Ideally, we would do a new random number generator for each additional selection rather than continuing down the list to completely eliminate those possibilities, but in the current model, I believe Tal is disqualified and will stay that way.
> 
> If Luigi still wants to remove himself, then the next selectee will be the one in the 13th position, not Tal in the disqualified 8th.
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> On 7/8/2020 1:09 PM, NomCom Chair 2020 wrote:
>> Luigi Iannone has informed me his affiliation has recently changed to "Huawei". That would make 3 Huawei people, which means one must be disqualified. 
>> Luigi requested that, since he was the person who didn't mention this prior to selection, he should be the one removed. I have no problem with this, so I will honor this request rather than removing Tal Mizrahi (as the last of the Huawei people selected). 
>> 
>> So, here is the updated list:
>> 
>> 65. Dirk Kutscher, University of Applied Sciences Emden/Leer
>> 114. Ketan Jivan Talaulikar, Cisco Systems, India
>> 127. Christopher Wood, Cloudflare
>> 38. Xuesong Geng, Huawei
>> 121. Rüdiger Volk, no affiliation
>> 86. Gabriel Montenegro, Independent
>> 18. Pablo Camarillo, Cisco Systems
>> 13. Chris Bowers, Juniper Networks
>> 85. Tal Mizrahi, Huawei
>> 94. Tony Przygienda, Juniper
>> 
>> Disqualified selections are noted below:
>> 58. LUIGI IANNONE, Huawei (Maximum of 2 for Huawei reached) - 8th in randomness order, but requested to be the one removed
>> 96. Reshad Rahman, Cisco (Maximum Number of 2 for Cisco reached) - 10th in randomness order
>> 
>> With this updated announcement, the challenge period continues through Wednesday, July 15, 2020 at 23:59 UTC, wherein the community may challenge the results to the NomCom Chair (in writing, by email).  See RFC 8713, Section 4.17 for details.
>> 
>> I will be contacting the selected volunteers to ensure they remain willing and available to serve.
>> 
>> Random selection data used:
>> 
>> ** Random Source 1 - EuroMillions Lottery **
>> ** Date - Tuesday July 7, 2020 **
>> EuroMillions Lottery Results
>> https://www.euro-millions.com/results <https://www.euro-millions.com/results>
>> Tuesday, July 7, 2020 Results (drawn after 21:00 CEST):
>> https://www.euro-millions.com/results/07-07-2020 <https://www.euro-millions.com/results/07-07-2020>
>> (7 numbers, including the star balls: 5 numbers between 1 and 50 and 2 star balls between 1 and 12)  
>> 
>> 12 16 23 33 41 8 10
>> 
>> ** Random Source 2 - US Total Debt **
>> ** Date - Monday July 6, 2020 **
>> US Total Debt
>> https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/pd_debttothepenny.htm <https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/pd_debttothepenny.htm>
>> Monday July 6, 2020 (as published after 3pm EDT on Tuesday July 7): 
>> (Last 8 digits entered as a single number, ignore the commas and periods -- 6 digits before the period and 2 digits after) 
>> 
>> 23703560
>> 
>> ** Random Source 3 - Australian TattsLotto **
>> ** Date - Saturday July 4, 2020 **
>> TattsLotto Results
>> https://thelott.com/tattslotto/results <https://thelott.com/tattslotto/results> 
>> Saturday July 4, 2020 results:
>> (6 winning numbers, between 1 and 45; no Supps numbers)
>> 
>> 17 31 33 35 39 42 
>> 
>> ** Random Source 4 - Emirates Loto **
>> ** Date - Saturday July 4, 2020 **
>> https://www.emiratesloto.com/loto/winningnumber/previous <https://www.emiratesloto.com/loto/winningnumber/previous>
>> Saturday July 4 results:
>> (6 winning numbers, between 1 and 49)
>> 
>> 10 20 21 24 26 34 
>> 
>> --------------- tool output -----------
>> Key is:
>>  8.10.12.16.23.33.41./23703560./17.31.33.35.39.42./10.20.21.24.26.34./
>> index        hex value of MD5        div  selected
>>  1  270D83B3AFE172BE3DAE13D5AFE10025  143  -> 65 <-
>>  2  FE6FBE4A6FCAEFD6570D957596C0BC9A  142  -> 114 <-
>>  3  AD10AAF6B527062D0E2F0E7B29AD3546  141  -> 127 <-
>>  4  8614C1D4C4EBFACE6A5049AF1F9782CD  140  -> 38 <-
>>  5  7D1EE81F1788AEA0FF359230F8096076  139  -> 121 <-
>>  6  E7013327C78EA666CFA0ADD69E017D37  138  -> 86 <-
>>  7  67135E88868DFC359459BF509920ACBD  137  -> 18 <-
>>  8  ADDCDE6B8985E911E19CC6107B587597  136  -> 58 <-
>>  9  D520F04487BA1AFE92B49AE7C613A7D0  135  -> 13 <-
>> 10  4CC1EA463D3BC82C7009830F8ACDF431  134  -> 96 <-
>> 11  9366F9278BD4CEE289093677432B2C03  133  -> 85 <-
>> 12  A60E734755D605CD1189716F7FB1183E  132  -> 94 <-
>> 
>> Barbara Stark
>> nomcom-chair-2020 at ietf dot org
>> 
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