IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: Tolerance

Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@gmail.com> Tue, 16 July 2019 23:54 UTC

Return-Path: <melinda.shore@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC187120091 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:54:52 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.999
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qvKKFA4DXquv for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:54:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pg1-x531.google.com (mail-pg1-x531.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::531]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E10F512004C for <ietf@ietf.org>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:54:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pg1-x531.google.com with SMTP id u17so10209526pgi.6 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:54:50 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Q/9aWZ77M2vb3AEdfvRvqEGm1T2dOWAcR2t0/NzR9JM=; b=QnAHF51foLr+P3Pcn/JNUybVUC02wxYPR8+/gogHGkgnVibTqfcW3SMcE7dM5DFqrt W6fMgkIm2omO63506YIIlyb2LMSdtYUL4GmPw05JcnG69ssNxfpmEsJhsnCpcT61TmIm qDtp7b97g23J10MuwdS/BNsOZVvMxdJxfUJiqSY+dwrZPzQypi7hH1BWfz9HT7L7Orre ee1QvMJ2TYhpkFmBNOQ82lHlak+ScTJlJ2np/8wQk5DV0PIOdoHdrNldXeDlni0p1skO N05dAddIB5dMkydeCE0jG7SyeP6lIN811XmzMzsilTKGLsmplFd8kzSM2j7pAhL+H7Ol SlXw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Q/9aWZ77M2vb3AEdfvRvqEGm1T2dOWAcR2t0/NzR9JM=; b=iASRVRC7sBq1v0zCyY8nfWaSzV1GwS0/EGBPU7fKoq1npJ6OQUnM0zlYT9gFkUO+xZ uQbf/6zba4keiZdW6ZBAl15tFCv3DirgCfveQDRX0MsE3cGnpAfSs6OqdXoiKdXK8QGB 3yCGMZqLSDB1KyCOinBXCY8HCxbpauNEoPfwuMPXDYuaKIYlA9PI9vNjo70xGYg9PR32 BpcT817bxtXsM4fYoZV4+lg4YD2h34grA+BMl3rFa8K2fVq9SQCUaLMpfHi/PxijviDB f8C0Wx7wpGvBJqgpN61FE858oWhFC2bF6ogAmuVss81Kc3W+/f6MGjZ/XaHa63ojW1PA B2eA==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUuAy071oDD3kIWE4hhZC1LIvY+XNsX9Iogiee70bH9vRpgam3c JtmH/gr69TpZHSZIG8denhnI+bUV
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzYYdwEWNucl37+4+v/EUEav6+RcKfkNQHjIWmoEthf53o8+1F2pDY043ZSkW956bBnIztN/Q==
X-Received: by 2002:a63:2606:: with SMTP id m6mr37006900pgm.436.1563321290016; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:54:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from aspen.local (63-140-64-252.dynamic.lte.acsalaska.net. [63.140.64.252]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f64sm23245408pfa.115.2019.07.16.16.54.48 for <ietf@ietf.org> (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:54:49 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Tolerance
To: ietf@ietf.org
References: <6EB5A0D4-DC17-40A8-B144-DC28F81C576A@employees.org> <A6135702-2156-48F1-A5D3-5F5EAE1B12B3@cooperw.in> <e24cae63-1a9b-7160-73cc-77c29e479eed@comcast.net> <9447eb2b-fd9f-4fa7-8e07-0bc0ad118292@gmail.com> <560a8a2b-3ece-4db9-4bf8-f16acbdc27a4@comcast.net> <ac5eec46-85d9-835a-fc53-02bb97fd25ab@gmail.com> <3b5c74d6-e219-512d-1c02-c7c66ca2573e@eff.org> <52052311-c9ed-7bbb-7f7e-edc1b0119075@network-heretics.com> <dcd35f0b-2388-ffbe-2feb-7bb6268e3cf5@eff.org> <02d3fb41-553a-eaf3-e77b-4918955ead48@gmail.com> <CAA=duU145Niuk1UtjvtM+R+LeL4jsE19Vb5=MWkV1MVmgA-LRQ@mail.gmail.com> <CAL02cgQsz=tgU6xCA5h+kV5HApZfpuU59stEmkmOpcsd2WzsUw@mail.gmail.com> <00dcede6-11a0-6a33-d4b4-ceb413f22874@gmail.com> <21fa0425-ca36-6f65-0585-2ddc64f368db@gmail.com> <15E6A25F-695F-4AAA-925B-87F40D699FB8@live555.com>
From: Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f2c23d46-19fb-a497-bbf6-7b4714546e2e@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 15:54:47 -0800
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.8.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <15E6A25F-695F-4AAA-925B-87F40D699FB8@live555.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/3TdijUk53TKEEW_wSepeyKe83RE>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 23:54:53 -0000

On 7/16/19 3:49 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote:
> While true, this begs the question of whether the decline in interest
> in working with the IETF is due to our “tone of discussions”.  One
> should also consider the possibility that some people are being
> driven away by the IETF’s recent increased focus on ‘proper behavior’
> - or for other reasons entirely.

I dunno.  On the one hand, I've talked with several smart people
with good insights and superior technical chops who've come to one
meeting and said they won't be back because of the "quality" of
the community.  My own sense is that if people feel overly constrained
by being expected to treat other participants with respect and/or
courtesy, well, "Bye, Felicia."

Melinda


-- 
Melinda Shore
melinda.shore@gmail.com

Software longa, hardware brevis

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email