Re: [111attendees] [Tools-discuss] Positive observations and proposals for improvements to Meetecho (was: Re: Re: So, what are jabber scribes actually doing, these days?)

Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca> Sun, 01 August 2021 20:37 UTC

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From: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
To: "Bron Gondwana" <brong@fastmailteam.com>, 111attendees@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [111attendees] [Tools-discuss] Positive observations and proposals for improvements to Meetecho (was: Re: Re: So, what are jabber scribes actually doing, these days?)
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Bron Gondwana <brong@fastmailteam.com> wrote:
    > *a "temporary mute" mode that keeps the audio stream open:*

    > This is still an issue for me.  I often mute myself while chairing so I
    > can take notes without my keyboard sound interrupting the chat - but it
    > means that I can't easily respond to somebody because the rejigging of
    > the audio channel not only creates a hiccup in the incoming audio feed
    > which means I might miss something someone says, but it also creates
    > enough of a delay that by the time I could have responded the other
    > party's mental state has moved on.

Yes, the 3s on/off latency on the audio is a problem.
So one should use a local mute instead, which of course, then causes confusion.

    > Timing is really important in conversation and we're already fighting
    > with the quarter second delay imposed by the size of the planet.
    > Additional delay makes it unwieldy.

Ah... I know of a genetically spliced lab mouse with a plan to reduce the size of the planet.

    > *allow multiple connections by the same person to the same session:*

    > I have multiple times wanted to switch device temporarily - from my
    > desktop computer to a phone / ipad so I can temporarily move to another
    > location while continuing to follow a meeting.  Multiple connection
    > support would mean I could switch over without a break.

It seems like a stretch requirement, but I also know that some chairs want a
second laptop so that they can see whether slides are really advancing.
What I don't understand is, 16 months into pandemic, and 10 years into screen
sharing, how it is that PPT people don't understand that they have to "F5"
before they share.

    > Sure it could be abused by people "sharing" a login, but that would be
    > pretty obvious if both parties tried to participate, and given that we
    > allow fee waivers anyway, it's unlikely to be abused significantly.
    > Sure there are Jabber naming issues, but we can avoid that by giving
    > each jabber name with a serial number (which I believe already happens
    > now?)

Yes. Actually, the ephermalness of the jabber names annoys me, as I can't
message people after they have left.

    > *information about who is speaking in the same place as video feeds*

The video image does do the yellow square when they are speaking.

    > See my previous email :)  Basically the "participant list" should just
    > be an ordered list of participants and only needs to be switched to
    > when seeing who is in the call or opening an individual message to them
    > (and people don't get moved out of order when they're sending
    > something).  The "who is sending something" list should be all together
    > with the video, and chairs pinned even if they're sending nothing right
    > now.

I think that I need a picture.
As my meetecho windows are more vertical than horizontal, I'd also like to be
able to move the video boxes to be under the slides.
see:  https://www.sandelman.ca/mcr/IETF111-virtual-SFO-two-sessions.png

    > Along with visual indicators of "currently sending audio" on people so
    > we know who of those with their audio channel open are currently
    > speaking, this makes it easier to look in one place to see the source
    > of all sound, and eyes can generally flit between the right hand side
    > (video and audio indicators) and the slides, without needing to also
    > track via the participant list.

I think that it would also work better for the youtube recording.

    > *flexible "assign chair"**:*

    > This one hasn't come up in practice, but the chairs for meetings are
    > pre-assigned from datatracker.  It would be great for ADs and the
    > meetecho reps in each meeting to be able to upgrade anybody to a chair
    > role or remove a chair role with a simple click.

That's a good idea.
And with that power, they should be able to advance slides, no matter who
activated them.

    > This has become less important with the ability for individuals to turn
    > on both audio and video themselves, so the chair is going less busywork
    > just approving access, but it would be good to make it possible for
    > someone else to step into the chair if the regular chairs are unable to
    > attend or lose network, rather than making the meeting less able to
    > run.

I'd like the chair to be able to pre-authorize sharing and slides.
Actually, the way I'd implement is that the chair(s) just get to decide who
of the possibly many screen-sharing/slides that are occuring, who is actually
shared.

That lets people (a) test their setup in advance of their slot,
(b) reduce the time to switch.

--
]               Never tell me the odds!                 | ipv6 mesh networks [
]   Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works        |    IoT architect   [
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