Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113
Eliot Lear <lear@lear.ch> Wed, 13 April 2022 08:46 UTC
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Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2022 10:45:53 +0200
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To: Vittorio Bertola <vittorio.bertola=40open-xchange.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, Jay Daley <exec-director@ietf.org>
Cc: Manycouches@ietf.org
References: <7e716ee4-d243-1a1b-cd61-b2adb541350a@lear.ch> <7985BE2D-F76A-454D-A87D-43D4B4968314@ietf.org> <355979943.1061.1649838465078@appsuite-gw1.open-xchange.com>
From: Eliot Lear <lear@lear.ch>
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Subject: Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113
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Hi Vittorio, Just on this point: On 13.04.22 10:27, Vittorio Bertola wrote: >>> >>> I listened to the recording of the shmoo meeting regarding Daniel's >>> analysis, and I took from it several points. The points I took away >>> were these: >>> >>> * By some models on average, individuals that attend three >>> meetings per year create as much emissions as an average German >>> in one year. >>> > This is a one-size-fits-all approach which is unfair and rather > dangerous. Many of us, including myself, have made choices to reduce > their environmental footprint long ago. Well good for you, and for our children. However, that bullet is a predicate with the premise being a consumption model. While you can agree or disagree with the model (show your work if you do), if the premise is true then the predicate holds. To put this another way, just because a polluter decides to pollute just a little less, doesn't mean that person's pollution has lowered to an acceptable level. I will elaborate that bullet in one way, however: the average in that model likely means that each German in that case is charged with emissions from German industry. An individual German may not be able to reduce their emissions. I'm sure Daniel's point was to by no means castigate Germans or any other nationality but simply to shed light on *our* impact to the environment in relaion to what *we *can do to make things better. Eliot
- [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Eliot Lear
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Jay Daley
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - "ca… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - "ca… Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Eliot Lear
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - vir… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - "ca… John Scudder
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Daniel Migault
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Fred Baker
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Stewart Bryant
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Simon Leinen
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - vir… Fred Baker
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Fred Baker
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Michael Richardson
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 John Levine
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - vir… Fred Baker
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - vir… John C Klensin
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - vir… Eliot Lear
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Eliot Lear
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Vittorio Bertola
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - "ca… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - car… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - vir… Charles Eckel (eckelcu)
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Lars Eggert
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Simon Leinen
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Michael Richardson
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 BRUNGARD, DEBORAH A
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Christian Huitema
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Michael Richardson
- Re: [Manycouches] trains and planes, Daniel prese… John Levine
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 - car… Daniel Migault
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Daniel Migault
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Vittorio Bertola
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Fred Baker
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Christian Huitema
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Fred Baker
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Manycouches] Daniel presentation @ 113 Daniel Migault