Re: [Cfrg] Requesting removal of CFRG co-chair

"Dan Harkins" <> Tue, 24 December 2013 22:13 UTC

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Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2013 14:13:07 -0800
From: Dan Harkins <>
To: Tao Effect <>
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Cc: Trevor Perrin <>, "" <>, Brian Weis <>, David McGrew <>
Subject: Re: [Cfrg] Requesting removal of CFRG co-chair
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On Tue, December 24, 2013 12:25 pm, Tao Effect wrote:
> On Dec 24, 2013, at 3:09 PM, Dan Harkins <> wrote:
>>  The lack of opportunity to raise objections is due to the fact that he
>> (and the others who recently subscribed to CFRG because they follow him
>> on twitter and heeded his call to join the crusade) were not involved at
>> the time.
> Sorry, I don't quite follow your logic.
> Are you saying that the appointment was made without a request for
> feedback because some people were not subscribed to this list?

  No, that would be ludicrous.  I'm saying that the complaints today of
people who were not involved in the CFRG at that time and who still
do not understand the process involved ring particularly hollow.

>> Realize too that had Kevin's employer not given these people the
>> opportunity to strike their fashionable pose there would be no
>> discussion
>> of IRTF process or what the CFRG's place in the world is.
> The issues that have been raised are nothing but "fashionable poses"?
> How do you figure that?

  Because the complaints in this thread about the NSA are not doing
anything to address the issue of pervasive monitoring. In fact, as
Stephen pointed out, you're detracting from that important effort with
this stupid crusade and your (excellent quote) "infantile gibberish".

  What you're doing is striking a pose, and giving yourself the opportunity
to pat yourself on the back for your stand against the NSA. You're not
actually helping out here though.

>> So this really
>> isn't about IRTF process or the CFRG. It all comes back to the
>> conspiracy
>> theory, and the guilt-by-association, and the fallacious ad hominem
>> attacks.
> What is the "conspiracy theory"?
> What are the "fallacious ad hominem attacks"?

  Read the thread. And read the Tao of the IETF. And learn about how
things work here. Test the waters before you dive in, that way you
don't bang your head on a rock and hurt yourself.

  Merry Christmas to all!