Re: [mpls] Poll 2: New SPL vs re-purposed ELI for carrying Network Action Indicators

[[e-mail]]

Hi Greg,


From: Greg Mirsky <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2022 6:19 PM
To: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET <[e-mail]>
Cc: Tony Li <[e-mail]>; Zafar Ali (zali) <[e-mail]>; [e-mail]; [e-mail]; [e-mail]; DetNet Chairs <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [mpls] Poll 2: New SPL vs re-purposed ELI for carrying Network Action Indicators

Hi Bruno,
thank you for the clarification, that helps a lot. From the perspective of MNA requirements, I'd imagine that supporting the association of meta-data with MNAI is essential and any proposal we adopt must have it. If that is the case, what is the role of a stand-alone document that is limited to EL and Slice-ID? Why wouldn't it be a section of a document that addresses all the MNA requirements?

Why would all components of the solutions (e.g. indicators, post-stack data, in-stack data) would need to be defined in a single document?
And even assuming a single "document that addresses all the MNA requirements", why would that document could not reference other documents for some components?

At this point of editorial comments, I guess that you don't have further technical comments on draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id.

Regards,
--Bruno

Regards,
Greg

On Mon, Jun 20, 2022 at 8:38 AM <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
Hi Greg,

Please see inline [Bruno]

From: Greg Mirsky <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Sent: Friday, June 17, 2022 9:56 PM

Hi Bruno,
thank you for the expedient response. If I understand you correctly, PSD can be used as part of draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id.
[Bruno] I would phrase it differently:
- draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id can be used to carry 8 indicators in the stack while being usable with existing LSP Egress (more indicators would require extension on the LSP egress)
- one of these indicators may be used to indicate the presence of PSD. The format/solution for PSD is orthogonal; one example being https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-jags-mpls-ext-hdr-00#section-5

Regards,
--Bruno

If that is the case, I think adding more information on how PSD can be used by the mechanism described in draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id would be helpful.

Regards,
Greg



On Fri, Jun 17, 2022 at 9:54 AM <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
Hi Greg,

Please see inline [Bruno]

From: Greg Mirsky <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Sent: Friday, June 17, 2022 5:46 PM
To: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Cc: Tony Li <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>; Zafar Ali (zali) <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>; [e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>; [e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>; [e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>; DetNet Chairs <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Subject: Re: [mpls] Poll 2: New SPL vs re-purposed ELI for carrying Network Action Indicators

Hi Bruno,
you've said that your proposal allows for up to 8 MNA indicators. How do you envision the encoding of data associated with these indicators?

[Bruno] Two paths :
- post stack data.
- in-stack data located after the ELI, EL e.g. as proposed in draft-jags-mpls-ext-hdr (but different encoding would also work)

At this point, post-stack data is probably my preference as the use of the label stack is already specified/used hence brings constraints.

Regards,
--Bruno



Re-use the EL space? Or these can be only no-data MNAIs?

Regards,
Greg

On Fri, Jun 17, 2022 at 2:03 AM <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
Tony,



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From: Tony Li <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>> On Behalf Of Tony Li
Sent: Friday, June 17, 2022 5:26 AM
To: Zafar Ali (zali) <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Cc: Kireeti Kompella <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>; DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>; [e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>; [e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>; [e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>; DetNet Chairs <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Subject: Re: [mpls] Poll 2: New SPL vs re-purposed ELI for carrying Network Action Indicators


Zafar,

Again, my problem with Bruno's draft is that the limited space found in the ELI/EL LSE's is clearly insufficient to begin to capture the use cases that we already can foresee for MNA, much less provide any room for growth.  It doesn't scale. We need more bits.

[Bruno] Thank you for providing a technical argument.
draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id provides 8 indicators while being backward compatible with existing egress/signaling.
If more are required, solution can be extended to provide more indicators (and data) but at the cost of requiring new dataplane feature on the LSR egress (and new signaling). Just like the proposals using a new SPL.
The net benefit is that in the short/medium term more devices/deployments can start using those 8 indicators, while waiting for the new generation to support the new proposal.

Regards,
--Bruno




For that reason alone, Bruno's draft is not a tenable solution to MNA and discussing it further is pointless.

Tony


On Jun 16, 2022, at 7:32 PM, Zafar Ali (zali) <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:

Tony, Kireeti,

So "I do not want to modify my current implementation" is the argument to stop people interested in Bruno's draft from using it?
If such HW can/ need be modified to implement the new complex encoding scheme you proposed, why it cannot implement simple encoding in Bruno's draft?

Please also look at  https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id-04#section-4.4 and https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id-04#section-4.5

Thanks

Regards ... Zafar


From: Tony Li <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>> on behalf of Tony Li <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 3:10 PM
To: "Zafar Ali (zali)" <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Cc: Kireeti Kompella <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>, "[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>" <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>, "[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>" <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>, "[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>" <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>, "[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>" <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>, DetNet Chairs <[e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>>
Subject: Re: [mpls] Poll 2: New SPL vs re-purposed ELI for carrying Network Action Indicators




The draft has been implemented for the exact (SLID) use-case on hardware platforms based on Broadcom Jericho2 family of ASIC
Please take a look at https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-decraene-mpls-slid-encoded-entropy-label-id-04#section-7
No such issue was noted


And Jericho2 is the only thing that counts in the entire world?

T


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Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
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