Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext
"Debbie Garside" <debbie@ictmarketing.co.uk> Thu, 07 July 2011 16:59 UTC
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From: Debbie Garside <debbie@ictmarketing.co.uk>
To: 'Debbie Garside' <debbie@ictmarketing.co.uk>, 'Mark Davis ☕' <mark@macchiato.com>, 'Mykyta Yevstifeyev' <evnikita2@gmail.com>
References: <4E14F473.6030101@qualcomm.com> <4E152E4F.9070203@gmail.com> <CAJ2xs_Fm0NLOyL6PLps=77mb=o-gU2cCvi0=i0nj6NQJ01qnVw@mail.gmail.com> <075f01cc3cbf$0f04ba90$2d0e2fb0$@co.uk>
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Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2011 18:00:30 +0100
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Cc: 'Pete Resnick' <presnick@qualcomm.com>, ltru@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext
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Let me elaborate further on this. From memory, data in CLDR may be incorporated on a vote system, This vote system is linked to the amount paid by companies by way of subscriptions. Or am I wrong? I seem to remember a lot of Google data being incorporated (dumped) into CLDR against the wishes of experts in the field who had been working most diligently to make sure their data was correct. A paid for votes system is contrary to the entire ethos of IETF where, I believe, a general consensus is required rather than paid votes and affiliations are not taken into account. This is the basis for my concern. Maybe I am totally wrong and if so I apologise. Please feel free to correct me. If I am right, there is still a way for Unicode to do this, as stipulated within the RFC, but rather by recommendation to the IETF-Languages Registrar who can then invite further discussion. Best wishes Debbie From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Debbie Garside Sent: 07 July 2011 17:01 To: 'Mark Davis ☕'; 'Mykyta Yevstifeyev' Cc: 'Pete Resnick'; ltru@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext I am also concerned about the structure of the Unicode Committee and voting rights. Perhaps someone can explain how this will work and why it is required in addition to the current structure for the registration of language tags. Have I missed something here? (I probably have as I have been away from the list for some time) Have Unicode already taken over some of the duties of the BCP47 registrar? Best wishes Debbie From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Mark Davis ? Sent: 07 July 2011 15:43 To: Mykyta Yevstifeyev Cc: Pete Resnick; ltru@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Thanks for the feedback. We can make those corrections. One question. The primary reason that we chose to use a BCP was primarily because it provided a stable reference; the underlying RFCs can (and have) changed while "BCP47" has remained the same. Listing the current RFCs somewhat undercuts that. Note: if that is the practice we should do it, but it seems odd. Mark — Il meglio è l’inimico del bene — On Wed, Jul 6, 2011 at 20:55, Mykyta Yevstifeyev <evnikita2@gmail.com> wrote: Hello, I've identified the following issue in the draft. Section 2.2 says: The subtags in the 't' extension are of the following form: +--------+-------------------------+----------------------------+ | Label | ABNF | Comment | +--------+-------------------------+----------------------------+ | t_ext= | "t" | Extension | | | ("-" lang *("-" field) | Source + optional field(s) | | | / 1*("-" field)) | Field(s) only (no source) | | lang= | language | [BCP47 <http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-davis-t-langtag-ext-01#ref-BCP47> ], with restrictions | | | ["-" script] | | | | ["-" region] | | | | *("-" variant) | | | field= | sep 1*("-" 3*8alphanum) | With restrictions | | sep= | 1ALPHA 1DIGIT | Subtag separators | +--------+-------------------------+----------------------------+ I should note that, first of all, reference to RFC 5234 is missing; moreover, and this is more important, making the ABNF definition in the form of table makes such definition an invalid one, in terms of RFC 5234. Also, there are a number of ABNF nits here. So, please consider changing this to: The subtags in the 't' extension are of the following form, defined using ABNF [RFC5234] in <t-ext> rule: t-ext = "t" ("-" lang *("-" field) / 1*("-" field)) lang = langtag field = sep 1*("-" 3*8alphanum) sep = ALPHA DIGIT alphanum = ALPHA / DIGIT where <langta> rule is specified in BCP 47 [BCP47], <ALPHA> and <DIGIT> rules - in RFC 5234 [RFC5234]. Also, the minors comments on references. Reference to BCP 47 should include both references to RFC 5646 and RFC 4647, like: [BCP47] Phillips, A. and M. Davis, "Matching of Language Tags", BCP 47, RFC 4647, September 2006. Phillips, A., Ed., and M. Davis, Ed., "Tags for Identifying Languages", BCP 47, RFC 5646, September 2009. ...and, referencing UTS 35 you shouldn't reference specific parts of the document; this should be done in the text. Finally, I don't see where [US-ASCII] is used in the text. Thanks, Mykyta Yevstifeyev 07.07.2011 2:49, Pete Resnick wrote: Most of the people on the ietf-languages list are probably on the ltru@ietf.org list as well, but I wanted to confirm that everyone got a chance to review this before it proceeded to the IESG. Please have a look at the ltru archive <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/current/maillist.html> <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/current/maillist.html> and send any comments to the ltru@ietf.org list since that's where discussion seems to be taking place. Thanks. pr _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mykyta Yevstifeyev
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mykyta Yevstifeyev
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Peter Constable
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Phillips, Addison
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Pete Resnick
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Pete Resnick
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mykyta Yevstifeyev
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Roozbeh Pournader
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Roozbeh Pournader
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Roozbeh Pournader
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Phillips, Addison
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext John Cowan
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Kent Karlsson
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext doug
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Peter Constable
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Peter Constable
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Broome, Karen
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Phillips, Addison
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Kent Karlsson
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Debbie Garside
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Phillips, Addison
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Phillips, Addison
- [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mykyta Yevstifeyev
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Peter Saint-Andre
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Felix Sasaki
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Bjoern Hoehrmann
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mykyta Yevstifeyev
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Jukka K. Korpela
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Randy Presuhn
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext CE Whitehead
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Phillips, Addison
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext CE Whitehead
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext CE Whitehead
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Avram Lyon
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Gordon P. Hemsley
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕
- Re: [Ltru] draft-davis-t-langtag-ext yoshito_umaoka
- [Ltru] Fw: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext yoshito_umaoka
- Re: [Ltru] Fw: draft-davis-t-langtag-ext Mark Davis ☕