[saag] Re: RFCs vs Standards

Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> Tue, 10 December 2024 19:48 UTC

Return-Path: <cabo@tzi.org>
X-Original-To: saag@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: saag@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B749C14F6FC for <saag@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 10 Dec 2024 11:48:52 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.906
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.906 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_SAFE_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vxvO0cjCtovF for <saag@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 10 Dec 2024 11:48:51 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature ECDSA (P-256) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CA658C14F5F8 for <saag@ietf.org>; Tue, 10 Dec 2024 11:48:49 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.217.145] (p548dc3ec.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.141.195.236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4Y78Ry2pB0zDCfn; Tue, 10 Dec 2024 20:48:46 +0100 (CET)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\))
From: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
In-Reply-To: <GVXPR07MB9678DF2C14EA44B28C3DA372893D2@GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2024 20:48:45 +0100
X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 755552925.812723-6fd69b05f4412fa7c34d5a3a8cb65bc4
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <F304B6BA-6969-4C62-A217-88E76F82CDC2@tzi.org>
References: <BE95E617-C929-43BA-BB40-41E189A8158B@akamai.com> <87ldxl5zp9.fsf@kaka.sjd.se> <26424.40383.605711.370013@fireball.acr.fi> <71bcb4f8-e147-a6cb-3c67-b6daef61f309@mindrot.org> <26439.33533.129915.244853@fireball.acr.fi> <SY8P300MB0711C796AB6095C788556516EE292@SY8P300MB0711.AUSP300.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM> <15450.1732763286@obiwan.sandelman.ca> <3029EB03-6E7A-47CB-9682-F511CB51EE17@akamai.com> <10065.1732826193@obiwan.sandelman.ca> <CACsn0cmWVeFdJ3dzMj5SV4XpJF4rssULtfQ1moeefoq-Evhk=g@mail.gmail.com> <CAGL5yWb=tLvMOYFKT3ffVbcy7BAD=i4B0VHEUdkvwRvZ3X3Bsw@mail.gmail.com> <m2mshh4v8l.wl-randy@psg.com> <CABcZeBMjxNbBMYU2p3_a8-5VCExgmY-7XLof7die05YOEX-38A@mail.gmail.com> <70419651-6443-4393-9ca1-8a1c98a68db0@cs.tcd.ie> <CABcZeBNtBRxi5zSf9OvUip2AtyVD6Wt9+kQESuUzo-=Kur9+ZQ@mail.gmail.com> <fac981d9-2fe9-4a84-8af1-845acd72af58@cs.tcd.ie> <14124.1733073164@obiwan.sandelman.ca> <d52ee080-814b-46fd-9e0f-41349941eeac@cs.tcd.ie> <GVXPR07MB9678DF2C14EA44B28C3DA372893D2@GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
To: John Mattsson <john.mattsson=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7)
Message-ID-Hash: MLKOGDRIWVTZTTATOU3VCVD52Y7QRYQP
X-Message-ID-Hash: MLKOGDRIWVTZTTATOU3VCVD52Y7QRYQP
X-MailFrom: cabo@tzi.org
X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-saag.ietf.org-0; header-match-saag.ietf.org-1; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header
CC: "rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org" <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>, Paul Wouters <paul.wouters=40aiven.io@dmarc.ietf.org>, IETF SAAG <saag@ietf.org>
X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc6
Precedence: list
Subject: [saag] Re: RFCs vs Standards
List-Id: Security Area Advisory Group <saag.ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/saag/Oirul1nIy1JxnQIfWyGj___DVaY>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/saag>
List-Help: <mailto:saag-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Owner: <mailto:saag-owner@ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:saag@ietf.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:saag-join@ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:saag-leave@ietf.org>

On 2024-12-10, at 13:52, John Mattsson <john.mattsson=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
> 
> 	• Internet-drafts are obviously "permanent and readily available", I don’t see why that is debated. For registries wanting RFCs there is “RFC required”. I am against any registry saying that "permanent and readily available" internet-drafts are NOT OK, but pointing to a website outside of the IETF is…

This.

There really can’t be any discussion on the facts here.

Grüße, Carsten