Re: [Diversity] [Mentoring-coordinators] Participation in active IETF work

Dave Crocker <dhc@dcrocker.net> Tue, 19 April 2016 15:24 UTC

Return-Path: <dhc@dcrocker.net>
X-Original-To: diversity@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: diversity@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20F8512DD6A; Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:24:47 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.2
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K7ImCfJkOZ2v; Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:24:45 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from sbh17.songbird.com (sbh17.songbird.com [72.52.113.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7BC1212DBC8; Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:24:45 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.1.168] (76-218-8-128.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net [76.218.8.128]) (authenticated bits=0) by sbh17.songbird.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id u3JFOiFM016009 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:24:45 -0700
References: <5716488E.1090906@dcrocker.net> <320147208.2707625.1461078780566.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com>
To: nalini.elkins@insidethestack.com
From: Dave Crocker <dhc@dcrocker.net>
Organization: Brandenburg InternetWorking
Message-ID: <57164DB6.4020607@dcrocker.net>
Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:24:38 -0700
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.7.2
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <320147208.2707625.1461078780566.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.0 (sbh17.songbird.com [72.52.113.17]); Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:24:45 -0700 (PDT)
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/diversity/oK8YhrcYE0eZpymXyePAgZ_OnkI>
Cc: "diversity@ietf.org" <diversity@ietf.org>, "mentoring-coordinators@ietf.org" <mentoring-coordinators@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Diversity] [Mentoring-coordinators] Participation in active IETF work
X-BeenThere: diversity@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
Reply-To: dcrocker@bbiw.net
List-Id: Diversity open mailing list <diversity.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/diversity>, <mailto:diversity-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/diversity/>
List-Post: <mailto:diversity@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:diversity-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/diversity>, <mailto:diversity-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2016 15:24:47 -0000

On 4/19/2016 8:13 AM, nalini.elkins@insidethestack.com wrote:
> I also think that if people wanted help in making their draft more
> readable - I am just talking about the English part of it, then maybe we
> need:
>
> 1.5  English Review Mentors
>
> These are people who will just review for grammar, sentence
> construction, readability, etc.


Well, my experience for such documents is that the mentor needs to get 
deeply into the substance of the document and the process needs to be 
extended.

In my experience, simple language help is easy, but frankly not that 
common or at least not really different from what drafts by 'native' 
English speakers need.

The real challenge is developing an adequate understanding of what the 
author /intends/ and then helping to figure out how to write that well.

And for reference, it's not uncommon to have a draft from a 'native' 
English speaker that also needs this sort of help...

d/
-- 

   Dave Crocker
   Brandenburg InternetWorking
   bbiw.net