Re: [Ideas] [lisp] WG Review: IDentity Enabled Networks (ideas)

John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com> Sat, 04 November 2017 21:37 UTC

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Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 17:37:12 -0400
From: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>
To: Tom Herbert <tom@herbertland.com>, Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>
cc: ideas@ietf.org, "lisp@ietf.org list" <lisp@ietf.org>, Christian Huitema <huitema@huitema.net>, Dino Farinacci <farinacci@gmail.com>, ietf@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [Ideas] [lisp] WG Review: IDentity Enabled Networks (ideas)
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--On Saturday, November 4, 2017 09:34 -0700 Tom Herbert
<tom@herbertland.com>; wrote:

>...
> A good example
> is turning up the TLS on the Internet; this eliminated the
> need to trust the network with our plaintext. 

And, for many people, replaces it with the need to trust
firewall and security appliance providers who have concluded
that they need to intercept and decrypt traffic in order to
identify malware and other undesirable traffic.   At least in
principle, one does get to choose which vendor to trust and does
know (by virtue of having to install special certificates) which
vendor or provider is being trusted, but those options may not
be meaningful for typical users.

I worry with that example and several others that the IETF is
not adequately distinguishing between "increasing privacy" or
"preventing mass surveillance" on the one hand and forcing users
into a "who do your trust" or even "who does someone trust on
your behalf" shell game on the other.

best,
   john