Re: bettering open source involvement
Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com> Fri, 29 July 2016 00:41 UTC
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From: Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2016 20:40:57 -0400
Message-ID: <CAG4d1re-5_NCOZxUMOjgr_fpG=vi=N5EwTK9UgU1w_kUWFjXWQ@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: bettering open source involvement
To: "Bjoern A. Zeeb" <bzeeb-lists@lists.zabbadoz.net>
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On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 8:34 PM, Bjoern A. Zeeb < bzeeb-lists@lists.zabbadoz.net> wrote: > On 28 Jul 2016, at 21:06, Brian E Carpenter wrote: > > And there's our problem, right there. Protocols without APIs are >> pretty much useless these days. IPv6 without a socket API would have >> been an abject failure. Without RFC 2133, RFC 2292 and their successors, >> who knows how the POSIX and Winsock support for IPv6 would have turned >> out? >> > > 2367 is a sad story for me personally as people went off and extended it > everywhere and now we have an incompatible mish-mash in the world. Just > saying, maintenance is also important, and an easy and sensible way to get > updates folded back in. > > The longer I think about publishing and obsoleting RFCs the more I want an > Open Source model for them and put them in version control and just update > them in place (not major extensions, but ..)—but that’s a different > discussion. > How would that work combined with very wide deployment and independent implementations? I understand and sympathize greatly with interest in experimenting with new methods - but I think it needs more of a story that understands the stability assumed and doesn't cause folks to have to revisit the documents every year or less to see if their implementations need updating. This is going to be an interesting situation with YANG models, where we may see fairly rapid evolution. What could we do different that still considers where standards are on the innovation/stability curve? Incidentally, I'm not sure where prejudice against APIs has come from. Of course, it doesn't frequently come up in routing... Regards, Alia > … > >> >> but there are groups out there >>> implementing IETF protocols and providing the APIs that allow >>> application developers to use those protocols and services. >>> That is part of the open source landscape, as well. >>> >> >> Sure. But if the protocol design, the API, and at least one implementation >> aren't developed in lock-step, what on earth are we doing? >> > > Writing RFCs which are 60ish pages long, use extra markers for the > important bits and had no implementation after 5 years. Can guess which > one I was talking about? > > /bz > >
- Re: bettering open source involvement Charles Eckel (eckelcu)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Harald Alvestrand
- Re: bettering open source involvement ned+ietf
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Ted Lemon
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement joel jaeggli
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Summary: bettering open source involvement S Moonesamy
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Philip Homburg
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Ted Lemon
- Re: bettering open source involvement Yoav Nir
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Eggert, Lars
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Charles Eckel (eckelcu)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Doug Ewell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Eggert, Lars
- Re: bettering open source involvement Paul Wouters
- Re: bettering open source involvement Joel M. Halpern
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Livingood, Jason
- Re: bettering open source involvement Livingood, Jason
- Re: bettering open source involvement Livingood, Jason
- Re: bettering open source involvement Ted Lemon
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement HANSEN, TONY L
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Andy Bierman
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Bjoern A. Zeeb
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement S Moonesamy
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Octavio Alvarez
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Suzanne Woolf
- Re: bettering open source involvement Bjoern A. Zeeb
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- bettering open source involvement Dave Taht