Re: bettering open source involvement
"Joel M. Halpern" <jmh@joelhalpern.com> Mon, 01 August 2016 14:09 UTC
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Subject: Re: bettering open source involvement
To: "Livingood, Jason" <Jason_Livingood@comcast.com>, Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@gmail.com>, Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, Suzanne Woolf <suzworldwide@gmail.com>
References: <CAA93jw71iUPb4vuFK5sMqo_CQEE9HSkchc9988=98FKUsv_1sw@mail.gmail.com> <CABSMSPUoBGgD6ioiCOScUUEnTUnGiNAYPavONyLpbWzNcRhvsg@mail.gmail.com> <42310584-34a6-5efc-59c3-ff7e7ec77624@gmail.com> <61563BA8-6790-43DE-B670-7040F206B9C9@gmail.com> <d56478d7-ae5c-381b-fd52-ee41d9a56358@gmail.com> <e4c113cd-dd59-5e02-39ff-70cf0896bfd9@gmail.com> <16aa8266-6856-93db-9a10-e3f5f30d2b93@gmail.com> <53A6AC53-89BD-4159-9AF2-EEEE0F5D9496@cable.comcast.com>
From: "Joel M. Halpern" <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
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Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2016 10:06:25 -0400
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While standards frequently take longer than we like, I would like to point out several other aspects. One thing I have observed is that the rush to code often produces work that needs to be completely reworked. As an example, in ODL the core adaptation layer had to be rewritten from scratch. Rushing to produce a wrong standard can be rather more expensive. On another angle, it often takes significant time to find all the issues and complications that affect the standard. It takes thought and discussion. And finally, the fact that we are trying to reach agreeement across people who often have very diverse implementations for very good reasons can create serious obstacle that take time and work to overcome. This is actually particularly apparent in what should be easy to standardize, because those are cases where folks have pre-standard implementations and have often taken very different approaches. One way of paraphrasing all of the above is that IETF standards take time because they matter. It is easy to throw something out there, see if it works, and see if people want to use it. It is not easy to get something put together that will work well when it is widely adopted. Yours, Joel On 8/1/16 9:42 AM, Livingood, Jason wrote: > On 7/28/16, 10:31 PM, "ietf on behalf of Melinda Shore" > <ietf-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of melinda.shore@gmail.com> wrote: >> For one thing, we already have too much work. > > In which case, maybe the IETF or certain WGs or Areas are focused on > the wrong work / wrong priorities? > >> This is completely subjective but my own sense is that the #1 >> problem we have related to open source projects we take years > to produce specifications. > > I certainly agree with that; the pacing of work seems greatly out of > step with what happens elsewhere in our tech community. I think this > tends to seriously scare off people who would otherwise be interested > in or benefit from participating at the IETF. > > - Jason > > > >
- Re: bettering open source involvement Charles Eckel (eckelcu)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Harald Alvestrand
- Re: bettering open source involvement ned+ietf
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Ted Lemon
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement joel jaeggli
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Summary: bettering open source involvement S Moonesamy
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Philip Homburg
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Ted Lemon
- Re: bettering open source involvement Yoav Nir
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Eggert, Lars
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement Charles Eckel (eckelcu)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Doug Ewell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Eggert, Lars
- Re: bettering open source involvement Paul Wouters
- Re: bettering open source involvement Joel M. Halpern
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Livingood, Jason
- Re: bettering open source involvement Livingood, Jason
- Re: bettering open source involvement Livingood, Jason
- Re: bettering open source involvement Ted Lemon
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- Re: bettering open source involvement HANSEN, TONY L
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Randy Bush
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Andy Bierman
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Stephen Farrell
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- Re: bettering open source involvement Dave Taht
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Bjoern A. Zeeb
- Re: bettering open source involvement Brian E Carpenter
- Re: bettering open source involvement Alia Atlas
- Re: bettering open source involvement S Moonesamy
- Re: bettering open source involvement Michael Richardson
- Re: bettering open source involvement Octavio Alvarez
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- RE: bettering open source involvement MH Michael Hammer (5304)
- Re: bettering open source involvement Melinda Shore
- Re: bettering open source involvement Suzanne Woolf
- Re: bettering open source involvement Bjoern A. Zeeb
- Re: bettering open source involvement Riccardo Bernardini
- bettering open source involvement Dave Taht