Re: [rfc-i] Poll: RFCs with page numbers (pretty please) ?

Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> Tue, 27 October 2020 18:16 UTC

Return-Path: <rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org>
X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12C3C3A146C; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:16:13 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.449
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.449 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MAILING_LIST_MULTI=-1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=fugue-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wMiZscCVUI0F; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:16:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A750B3A1451; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:16:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED687F40713; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:15:59 -0700 (PDT)
X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35205F40713 for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:15:59 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org
Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fugue-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com
Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 27iyJV1FsISo for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:15:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-qv1-xf42.google.com (mail-qv1-xf42.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::f42]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B5A99F40712 for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:15:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-qv1-xf42.google.com with SMTP id g13so1133669qvu.1 for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:16:05 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fugue-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=NjI+Opi39Uc9RDk9J1otmS4EudGyYP2xrs1NppOMlRs=; b=Xnam2YIAln8i3u7ST89FUXA9uWflaXU7CReK2e8ZCgWUFCvNj7qoCuugP60MNlnB38 2wIArBqdsUkggNwJG3mDeueSTEpTq9nuebuv+mjFPtS4AklqHFfdb5gcTkGduMpaFTT+ JwTiZpqPvDyuDCUsNCGxZw1e2FwdMa7VEMlu+gQMcaZD18P3dgp3skxjNKDYeavgoSh3 1cbU9fNgnug/ZrLIJ6nu4l/ut5h+BAZrPwynsB9LPIssHa7PX700M2VHHrp79igglOAj 5bxNb02gTlH0nOYtOk95DmgcuknkenVomDOcIcrayijZHEjPmxZ4IDuVQ637Nv19fLnq RvGw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=NjI+Opi39Uc9RDk9J1otmS4EudGyYP2xrs1NppOMlRs=; b=DOPjhgaX7n0d+lq5QdgN9678RnndsohvsWIp0dVEU96SVzegfZtjfHLOQm5AkSwMYS z2Z6BtzbEJtYXmVkBVrHhh4S1MIAG3es+Bsuc2qm+wjkshpkrNUXY2kY/+B+S6m+JDNq Ic21x3wOrBUPJgni98y2wVud7/TI/3cxN7M7vlPE3SlXfDRv98mgCGgTBAudFoPTLYzD xpsWBvm3g2/Ozxym0nZdK3lb2NTqc58Q1fjZiuBVSzKCL/rUYNBpjhq+afu/7SusjtJs p47/rbCa3v1p0jtjySc7ULdK33JHjw21AatAht7pnSm79xkL89rMhW/XdLRJ7wnIGvUB dYhg==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530+ruoShXCH7pyQY80k5WPiFg6pGw30eknrOBCIb1OF406dvcvg UN3Ov8Hfmh+5snNsEwFMmy9IhQ==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxwClpAXobdSoxF81YxOECVAlzjUmg7Tic4BKI7813xWGL3guc1cGXf6IggJnHB8n1Sm0PzLg==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6214:1541:: with SMTP id t1mr3593769qvw.61.1603822564939; Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:16:04 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.4.70] (c-24-91-177-160.hsd1.nh.comcast.net. [24.91.177.160]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l125sm1261040qke.23.2020.10.27.11.16.04 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:16:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
Message-Id: <C835600A-C79C-4FD0-B624-8D352B5D6169@fugue.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.1\))
Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2020 14:16:01 -0400
In-Reply-To: <34D4704E-5339-4A99-B537-91EC21656A1F@juniper.net>
To: John Scudder <jgs@juniper.net>
References: <20201026020433.GA19475@faui48f.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <CADaq8je8gMwAkOndTNJ9ndwzOZb2HQMZrCUJ5wNUjw-6ax9QtA@mail.gmail.com> <35EFE952-7786-4E24-B228-9BEE51D3C876@tzi.org> <20201026150241.GK48111@faui48f.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <20201026162814.GP39170@kduck.mit.edu> <20201026164036.GO48111@faui48f.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <1a56dc3b-56ef-3ffb-a12b-44d5e0d0f835@levkowetz.com> <20201026171931.GP48111@faui48f.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <b733240-fc78-5a71-8920-ff84fbf64287@iecc.com> <20201026180105.GQ48111@faui48f.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <03976f9f-7f49-7bf7-ce29-ee989232a44d@gmail.com> <7FA8EF59-5CDE-42B9-A487-520531EEA1F0@juniper.net> <m2sg9z1seh.wl-randy@psg.com> <3DC65259-20A7-4AFA-BC24-604AB184081E@fugue.com> <7AEF79AB-8CDF-4414-BBB8-D1EA9716F82F@juniper.net> <D0067A1E-2C86-4174-9344-9887120BA37E@fugue.com> <34D4704E-5339-4A99-B537-91EC21656A1F@juniper.net>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.1)
Subject: Re: [rfc-i] Poll: RFCs with page numbers (pretty please) ?
X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." <rfc-interest.rfc-editor.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/options/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.rfc-editor.org/pipermail/rfc-interest/>
List-Post: <mailto:rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=subscribe>
Cc: "rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org" <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>, "rsoc@iab.org" <rsoc@iab.org>, IETF Rinse Repeat <ietf@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7165264599099539044=="
Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org
Sender: rfc-interest <rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org>

On Oct 27, 2020, at 2:09 PM, John Scudder <jgs@juniper.net> wrote:
> Needless to say, the concern does not seem valid to me. 

I think there’s legitimate cause for debate on this question; I’m not sure what the correct venue would be, however.

One solution would be for Henrik to simply document how to patch xml2rfc to enable pagination and page numbers in the TOC. At that point, anybody paginating a document would have to read the instructions for how to modify xml2rfc, which could include clear instructions on how to treat the output in terms of referencing it.

I think the main argument for doing this and not simply asking Henrik to fix the primary source is that there really aren’t that many people who rely on this feature, and so even though those people would benefit significantly from a fix, the overall risk really does outweigh the benefit. Of course, there’s no way to quantify the risk, so this can never go beyond conjecture, which means that ultimately the decision is a judgment call, not math.


_______________________________________________
rfc-interest mailing list
rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest