Re: [72attendees] Clarifying Host Responsibilities (was Re: Guestroom Network not under NOC Control)

"Soininen Jonne (NSN FI/Espoo)" <> Tue, 29 July 2008 10:30 UTC

Return-Path: <>
Received: from [] (localhost []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id 508D43A6AB2; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:30:56 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D11A3A6AB2 for <>; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:30:55 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -5.665
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.665 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.934, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4]
Received: from ([]) by localhost ( []) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zb+7ajtb6tXU for <>; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:30:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ( []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id 975FB3A6B32 for <>; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:30:53 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ([]) by ( with ESMTP id m6TAV0Rv020382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:31:00 +0200
Received: from ( []) by ( with ESMTP id m6TAV0ct008895; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:31:00 +0200
Received: from ([]) by with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:31:00 +0200
Received: from ([]) by with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:30:59 +0200
Received: from ([]) by ([]) via Exchange Front-End Server ([]) with Microsoft Exchange Server HTTP-DAV ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 10:30:55 +0000
User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/
Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 13:30:53 +0300
From: "Soininen Jonne (NSN FI/Espoo)" <>
Message-ID: <>
Thread-Topic: [72attendees] Clarifying Host Responsibilities (was Re: Guestroom Network not under NOC Control)
Thread-Index: AcjxYgv4dhq8jbJvdkOl/RCHwLMYfQABCFi4
In-Reply-To: <>
Mime-version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Jul 2008 10:30:59.0540 (UTC) FILETIME=[31419940:01C8F166]
Subject: Re: [72attendees] Clarifying Host Responsibilities (was Re: Guestroom Network not under NOC Control)
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Discussion list for the attendees of IETF 72 meeting." <>
List-Unsubscribe: <>, <>
List-Archive: <>
List-Post: <>
List-Help: <>
List-Subscribe: <>, <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit


Your recollection of the past is a little bit different that mine. I
remember the last time you tried there were open ends in many things until
very late of the process. This and other reasons made the main host to
decide on a different venue (San Diego). Siemens was the host for that
possible meeting. The people who were mostly involved from Siemens are now
part of Nokia Siemens Network, who I happen to work for as well. The main
thing is that host was very much involved on the change of the meeting
location! If you want to talk about specifics of that time, I'm happy to
talk to you off-line.

It seems that the next scheduled European meeting without a host is at
Summer 2010. If you have a host, or funding to host, please, contact Drew
Dvorshak at or the IAD. If you even have a location in
mind, better it is!



On 7/29/08 1:01 PM, "ext JORDI PALET MARTINEZ" <>

> And when you find volunteer hosts which find the money, the venue and so on,
> such as myself in Madrid, trying for several years, then you disqualify the
> venue because is not in down-town ... A very fair comparison with this one
> or even San Diego.
> Madrid venue was much better (even being the first hotel in the world that
> offered IPv6 in the guest rooms several years ago, no filtered
> ports/protocols at all !), much better located, much cheaper, better
> commuting to downtown (cheaper and shorter), better food, more restaurant
> choices in the venue and around, etc.
> So the first that make the possible hosts and sponsors to step down is the
> organization itself with ridiculous decisions which are then taken as
> irrelevant for other venues (and Dublin is a very good example).
> Now I'm not sure wanting to spend anymore my cycles in retrying this again
> unless there is a firm commitment. I bothered the government to much to
> raise +150.000 Euros for sponsoring this and I'm not even sure they will
> consider it again.
> Regards,
> Jordi
>> From: Kurt Erik Lindqvist <>
>> Reply-To: <>
>> Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:18:31 +0200
>> To: Iljitsch van Beijnum <>
>> Cc: <>
>> Subject: Re: [72attendees] Clarifying Host Responsibilities (was Re:
>> Guestroom
>> Network not under NOC Control)
>> On 29 jul 2008, at 10.41, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote:
>>> On 29 jul 2008, at 0:07, Kurt Erik Lindqvist wrote:
>>>> "the powers that be" are trying to optimize location /
>>>> internationalization / the host that PAYs preferences to location
>>> The interesting thing is that the attendees ALSO pay for this.
>>> Now I understand that the IETF needs to get its funding where it can
>>> find it, but it can hardly be a surprise that if you make two sets
>>> of people pay for the same thing and optimize for the convenience of
>>> one party, the other is unhappy.
>> If you would have quoted a bit more of my email -  I actually further
>> said 'This equation is far from easy, '. The problem is that - as has
>> been discussed at length at IETFs for a long time - the attendance
>> fees, the host sponsorship and the contributions from ISOC, all pays
>> for the meetings AND the secretariat. At trust me from the years on
>> the IAOC - running the IETF is not a money making business. If we
>> can't find hosts, the attendance fees would have to go up
>> significantly. Add to that the the ROI in marketing for a hosts on
>> sponsoring an IETF in the first place is miniscule. Add to it the all
>> the negative comments from the IETFXX-lists and have that attached to
>> your brand and the marketing value is negative.
>> Personally I believe that we simply don't give the hosts (and the NOC
>> volunteers) enough credit for stepping up to the task of organizing a
>> meeting.
>> Best regards,
>> - kurtis -
>> PS, as most people have seems to have missed or ignored Andrews mail -
>> issues with the hotel network should go to the hotel, not the IETF list.
>> _______________________________________________
>> 72attendees mailing list
> **********************************************
> The IPv6 Portal:
> Bye 6Bone. Hi, IPv6 !
> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or
> confidential. The information is intended to be for the use of the
> individual(s) named above. If you are not the intended recipient be aware that
> any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this
> information, including attached files, is prohibited.
> _______________________________________________
> 72attendees mailing list

Jonne Soininen
Nokia Siemens Networks

Tel: +358 40 527 46 34

72attendees mailing list