Re: [hrpc] HRPC recharter

Privacy is not just a value on its own (and it is in fact a human right).
It actually helps with protecting other rights such as the right to
assembly and association, freedom of speech and others. Cultural relativism
when it comes to human rights is not very well substantiated and studied.

Farzaneh

On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 12:36 PM Adrian Gropper <agropper@healthurl.com>
wrote:

> The greatest contribution HRPC can make is to show how human rights are
> different from privacy and security. Talking about human rights in terms of
> privacy is confusing because privacy is cultural and human rights are
> universal. Talking about human rights in terms of security is confusing
> because security is expensive in many ways, including the inconvenience of
> high security practices.
>
> If we were to recharter I would opt for a clearer separation between
> Privacy, Security, and Human Rights considerations and having all three on
> equal footing in IETF standards.
>
> - Adrian
>
> On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 12:25 PM farzaneh badii <farzaneh.badii@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Most times, this practice of balancing rights favors the powerful who can
>> quash other people's rights and abuse their power. We can start from
>> debunking some narratives that, for example security and privacy are always
>> conflicting (they are sometimes but sometimes they are not and they are
>> quite aligned).
>>
>> And what do you mean by technical solutions? Technical solutions that
>> address the tradeoffs between rights? Am I getting this right? If so, then
>> I totally disagree, I think you cannot overcome the trade-off with
>> technical solutions. I don't want to misframe this but are backdoors
>> technical solutions? I prefer that policymakers actually understand the
>> technical limitations and the effect of their policies on the Internet and
>> values they want to uphold.
>>
>> P.S. John's disclaimers are always so apt. A genius lawyer must have
>> crafted them.
>>
>>
>> Farzaneh
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 3:18 AM Jens Finkhaeuser <jens@interpeer.io>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> > Nobody disputes that human rights concerns are a problem now. What many
>>> > of us have concerns about is how to balance the different and often
>>> > conflicting rights and interests at the time of protocol design.
>>>
>>> I wasn't quite sure how to parse this comment, and wanted to mull it
>>> over.
>>>
>>> So far, the group has focused on considerations documents, which raise
>>> the questions that one has to ask when balancing such things as you
>>> mention. I can't find it in me to see anything concerning about that. This
>>> may reveal conflicts in interests, but that is the entire point of asking
>>> questions. It's how you know that more work is needed - or a comment on why
>>> something can't be done in the design.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure what is concerning here.
>>>
>>> Jens
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> hrpc mailing list
>>> hrpc@irtf.org
>>> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc
>>>
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>