Re: (DMARC) We've been here before, was Why mailing lists

"John R Levine" <johnl@taugh.com> Fri, 18 April 2014 16:03 UTC

Return-Path: <johnl@taugh.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCD191A043C for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 18 Apr 2014 09:03:08 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -0.357
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.357 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2z5dc34h3ABl for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 18 Apr 2014 09:03:03 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from miucha.iecc.com (abusenet-1-pt.tunnel.tserv4.nyc4.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f06:1126::2]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F3FF1A015D for <ietf@ietf.org>; Fri, 18 Apr 2014 09:03:03 -0700 (PDT)
Received: (qmail 54179 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2014 16:02:59 -0000
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type:user-agent:cleverness; s=d39e.53514cb3.k1404; bh=4fyDsN94dczhs3oEaiayUyloKc0EQ6bfabicVUcMQdw=; b=NIRGRlfa6NfZct+lqH/WvN7pYYZF2fEXpuglfkGFTxrZ+zviFzMQPfFrpJswRb+GZWf2e4C3OKy/VYvodlcQP6LvKE7Q1StY4GjKarfwiHzC3091lYxP8Q5rFfGfQ/CyQE+9rHnxMQEQRf1TJk3ttot6IJjGd7HowUScNLlF/qZbeXjKul9FCi6NSVCB189SWikajqSGB6yE/w23hXG/jBMGVqPhnDiVHtYzepbRC4QO818SESg+4DiMQ491wSp9
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type:user-agent:cleverness; s=d39e.53514cb3.k1404; bh=4fyDsN94dczhs3oEaiayUyloKc0EQ6bfabicVUcMQdw=; b=Y8927JQsWnqFYYojqhgHjYbR1HCecSbWQrhfZ8rPnYHU5nC8vVTmSW12XM80qZJ1dAYEjLNfIXZnuAPUjkJM5vX06nl+7ecvXmWALKUr9aCOUO3YspPnojr9hpapG+f4N0tXSpYbgUmfCMrikpeRgJPKf9i7BY4OxDE6CKCLsWeuOogx3C1lfezayO6j5yWldeXFllkZnyChb25SOVeZz/hgtcwzBMfBo5I0tPO6WaPexPayw+lwO8SSAn0pqyKp
Received: from localhost ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.0/X.509/SHA1) via TCP6; 18 Apr 2014 16:02:59 -0000
Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2014 12:02:58 -0400
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.00.1404181201460.4704@joyce.lan>
From: John R Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
To: "Murray S. Kucherawy" <superuser@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: (DMARC) We've been here before, was Why mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAL0qLwb81CuZBv112Mj-SDmRx2WfmJPepThn-ebKx8NYaUbi-g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20140417181815.8A5871ACD1@ld9781.wdf.sap.corp> <9451.1397772992@sandelman.ca> <CAL0qLwa0a4nDAdCHkkMJdeemsj+cezcmH3+59CvhF8q7B72ryg@mail.gmail.com> <20140418154156.GB31301@thunk.org> <CAL0qLwb81CuZBv112Mj-SDmRx2WfmJPepThn-ebKx8NYaUbi-g@mail.gmail.com>
User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (BSF 1167 2008-08-23)
Cleverness: None detected
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset="US-ASCII"; format="flowed"
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/5FFYya3BPmg2Xf_uMxVB_GF2N6Y
Cc: "ietf@ietf.org" <ietf@ietf.org>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2014 16:03:09 -0000

> Any answer I give to that would be speculation.  How about this: If MUAs
> evolve as a result of all of this, I would hope it's in a direction that
> doesn't just create whack-a-mole for the problem DMARC is trying to solve.

That suggests it would be in the DMARC cartel's interest to avoid putting 
evolutionary pressure on MUAs to do things they won't like.  See you in 
ietf-822.

Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Taughannock Networks, Trumansburg NY
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail.