Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director
Sam Hartman <hartmans-ietf@mit.edu> Mon, 04 March 2013 19:59 UTC
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From: Sam Hartman <hartmans-ietf@mit.edu>
To: Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director
References: <21B86E13-B8DA-4119-BBB1-B5EE6D2B5C1D@ietf.org> <51330179.3040500@gmail.com> <919840EE-BEC8-4F82-8D3C-B116698A4262@gmx.net> <1D88E6E9-33DE-4C4D-89F4-B0B762155D6F@standardstrack.com> <D4D47BCFFE5A004F95D707546AC0D7E91F77BA46@SACEXCMBX01-PRD.hq.netapp.com> <3CB8992B-212A-4776-95FE-71CA1E382FFF@standardstrack.com> <513376DB.7000200@dcrocker.net> <E22ACC99-B465-4769-8B59-BB98A7BA93DF@gmx.net> <79E77523-3D92-4CE9-8689-483D416794EF@standardstrack.com> <D4D47BCFFE5A004F95D707546AC0D7E91F780D2F@SACEXCMBX01-PRD.hq.netapp.com> <071C6ED7-352C-4E74-A483-F5E7A3270FA5@gmail.com> <C726E531-57DC-4C42-9053-1394983126D6@vigilsec.com> <5134D5A0.4050209@gmail.com> <tsllia3m5lh.fsf@mit.edu> <5134F720.5010507@cisco.com>
Date: Mon, 04 Mar 2013 14:58:58 -0500
In-Reply-To: <5134F720.5010507@cisco.com> (Eliot Lear's message of "Mon, 04 Mar 2013 20:33:52 +0100")
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>>>>> "Eliot" == Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> writes: Eliot> Sam, Eliot> On 3/4/13 6:34 PM, Sam Hartman wrote: Eliot> We're here because of the extremely specialized nature of Eliot> transport. PhDs who specialize in it have gotten it wrong. Eliot> One such person drove Van Jacobson into the field, as I Eliot> recall. There are very few people who get it right. And yet Eliot> it's so close to the waist of the hour glass that it's Eliot> critical to get right. Security has a lot of visibility and Eliot> so it will never have this very same problem. I absolutely agree that there are few people who can design certain aspects of transport protocols. (I'll note that security has this problem too: designing crypto is really hard; I wouldn't be too quick to be sure that transport is so much more difficult than the hardest problems of other areas.) Fortunately, an AD need not do all the work in their area; they only need to review it. The entire IETF is founded on the idea of consensus. Central to that is the idea that we can get together as a group and by doing so we'll come up with better specifications. Not every person will be able to design the inputs to that process: new proposals and discoveries of problems in existing proposals. Some aspects of that really do require expert knowledge. my claim is that the AD skill set should be focused around evaluating these inputs, coming up with an opinion, and explaining that opinion to others. I don't believe that reviewing internet-drafts in transport, reviewing reviews of thoes drafts, evaluating whether enough review has happened, making an informed opinion about issues that were raised and explaining that opinion to the community requires the same level of expertise in transport as designing TCP. It does require significant experience, both technical and management. I stand behind my original comments.
- Appointment of a Transport Area Director IETF Chair
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Hannes Tschofenig
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eric Burger
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eric Burger
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director John C Klensin
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Joel M. Halpern
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Dave Crocker
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Scott Brim
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Michael Richardson
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Scott Brim
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Randy Bush
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director John Leslie
- RE: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Leaf Yeh
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eliot Lear
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Melinda Shore
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Hannes Tschofenig
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eric Burger
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Ralph Droms
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eric Burger
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Hector Santos
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Stewart Bryant
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director John Leslie
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Russ Housley
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Dale R. Worley
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Loa@pi.nu
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Elwyn Davies
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Dave Crocker
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Peter Saint-Andre
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Allison Mankin
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Andrew Sullivan
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Randy Bush
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Russ Housley
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Scott Brim
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eliot Lear
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Russ Housley
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eliot Lear
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Margaret Wasserman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Russ Housley
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Dave Crocker
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Mary Barnes
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Allison Mankin
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Benoit Claise
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Alia Atlas
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Benoit Claise
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Wesley Eddy
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Russ Housley
- RE: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Romascanu, Dan (Dan)
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director t.p.
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director t.p.
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- RE: Appointment of a Transport Area Director l.wood
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Margaret Wasserman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director t.p.
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Russ Housley
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Eggert, Lars
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Dave Crocker
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director PFRC - jhaas
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Bob Braden
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director t.p.
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Joe Touch
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Dave Crocker
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Melinda Shore
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Joe Touch
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Carsten Bormann
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director David Kessens
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Jari Arkko
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Margaret Wasserman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Jari Arkko
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Margaret Wasserman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Michael StJohns
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Joe Touch
- How do they select people (was: Appointment of a … SM
- Re: How do they select people joel jaeggli
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Toerless Eckert
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director S Moonesamy
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Toerless Eckert
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Toerless Eckert
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Carsten Bormann
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Margaret Wasserman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Toerless Eckert
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Toerless Eckert
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Toerless Eckert
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Greg Shepherd
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director David Kessens
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director David Kessens
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Toerless Eckert
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Dave Crocker
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Samuel Weiler
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Sam Hartman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Margaret Wasserman
- Re: Appointment of a Transport Area Director Martin Stiemerling