IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [rtcweb] Congratuiations on the Cisco announcement - but we still prefer VP8

David Singer <singer@apple.com> Thu, 07 November 2013 06:36 UTC

Return-Path: <singer@apple.com>
X-Original-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4629921E80D5 for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 6 Nov 2013 22:36:06 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.539
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.539 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.060, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Mt3Ih24RHW81 for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 6 Nov 2013 22:35:59 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-in2.asia.apple.com (mail-out.asia.apple.com [17.82.254.64]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3698E21E80CA for <rtcweb@ietf.org>; Wed, 6 Nov 2013 22:35:59 -0800 (PST)
Received: from relay3.asia.apple.com ( [17.82.200.17]) by mail-in2.asia.apple.com (Apple Singapore Mail Gateway) with SMTP id CC.DC.03695.DC43B725; Thu, 7 Nov 2013 14:35:57 +0800 (MYT)
X-AuditID: 1152fe06-b7f5a6d000000e6f-72-527b34cdc511
Received: from gambooge.asia.apple.com ( [17.82.200.120]) (using TLS with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by relay3.asia.apple.com (Apple Singapore relay) with SMTP id 0A.4A.26194.DC43B725; Thu, 7 Nov 2013 14:35:57 +0800 (MYT)
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET="US-ASCII"
Received: from [17.83.34.149] (unknown [17.83.34.149]) by mail.asia.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 7u4-24.01 (7.0.4.24.0) 64bit (built Nov 17 2011)) with ESMTPSA id <0MVV00DHARNWAA70@mail.asia.apple.com> for rtcweb@ietf.org; Thu, 07 Nov 2013 14:35:57 +0800 (SGT)
From: David Singer <singer@apple.com>
In-reply-to: <CAOqqYVEiBuq01f_87=wNv-vuMhT-ZUXkhQ+gf2n7HiVLpf++qA@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2013 15:35:57 +0900
Message-id: <6172AAE4-E59B-4B86-8C0F-DAE5BB2CAF2A@apple.com>
References: <CAOqqYVEER_HprgauRawO+_gGdLdMY1MUY8jrMhhi3yVDL31bFg@mail.gmail.com> <CAPvvaaLpbWGZPBB1EMOPKQd_+t95bvG51NG4DnKhtEp1WSwRhg@mail.gmail.com> <E32986AE-BE7F-4CEA-B387-1D03F05BD668@apple.com> <CAOqqYVEiBuq01f_87=wNv-vuMhT-ZUXkhQ+gf2n7HiVLpf++qA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Harald Alvestrand <hta@google.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1510)
X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrILMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUiGHRCUPesSXWQQdMmTYu1/9rZHRg9liz5 yRTAGMVlk5Kak1mWWqRvl8CVsWn5BdaCFo6K22dOMTUwbmHrYuTkkBAwkXjxsosRwhaTuHBv PVCci0NIYDejxJs3b1hhip5OWwmV6GeS+Hf8JxNIgldAUOLH5HssXYwcHMwC8hIHz8uChJkF tCS+P2plgahfyCSxo/skC0hCWCBa4tfOZ+wgNpuAqsSDOccYQXo5BYIlTr92BAmzAIWPdl1n gZjjInHj1CpWiFU2Et93zmKFmDmZSaLxy32whIiAmsTaKV1Qh8pKnD73HGyxhMBXVomW1tvs ExiFZyG5dRbCrbOQ3LqAkXkVo3huYmaObmaekV5icWaiXmJBQU6qXnJ+7iZGcED/Y9vBuOC1 4SFGAQ5GJR7e2W+LgoRYE8uKK3MPMUpwMCuJ8JobVQcJ8aYkVlalFuXHF5XmpBYfYpTmYFES 5/39tzxISCA9sSQ1OzW1ILUIJsvEwSnVwNjioFIa6XHlwnXehzUpB+em93zJeZKca6rLcMHx GIf3lDczDS/9vvmL6a9mms4P4Q1Ki2xTTm3S9H66QzbPICTl6sVTr20v/fhWuqcvvOBexOfj x633zTV5c/G96SO1qgS1uxmS53f2b778p1Jn8sP37wSu7Vvx+NOhqLCLBU/SNkgxTE1YLpKs xFKckWioxVxUnAgAZvbDI2QCAAA=
X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFlrJLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUiGHSiQvesSXWQweZ+dYu1/9rZHRg9liz5 yRTAGMVlk5Kak1mWWqRvl8CVsWn5BdaCFo6K22dOMTUwbmHrYuTkkBAwkXg6bSWULSZx4d56 IJuLQ0ign0ni3/GfTCAJXgFBiR+T77F0MXJwMAvISxw8LwsSZhbQkvj+qJUFon4hk8SO7pMs IAlhgWiJXzufsYPYbAKqEg/mHGME6eUUCJY4/doRJMwCFD7adZ0FYo6LxI1Tq1ghVtlIfN85 ixVi5mQmicYv98ESIgJqEmundLFCHCorcfrcc5YJjAKzkJw3C+G8WUjOW8DIvIpRtCg1J7HS WC+xODNRL7GgICdVLzk/dxMjJAAFdzB+mGp4iFGAg1GJh5fpdVGQEGtiWXFl7iFGCQ5mJRFe c6PqICHelMTKqtSi/Pii0pzU4kOM0hwsSuK8sv/Kg4QE0hNLUrNTUwtSi2CyTBycUg2M8YKW J6yars391L7LSEzv9IMAh9aT5hWveRJ90wzb487u2aqs15v57NHM7o31Ox981VZfNvHFu1fG 0Tedjuf2b1P/YDo5+kVmAItb8eJPz8/LHhbY/cR1jWzB3W2rF9x557Ams7PohlpF4IEzfJb7 DPYrspXMKX4UecH0QO8i2/q4h+11ndFflViKMxINtZiLihMBleLy8zwCAAA=
Cc: "rtcweb@ietf.org" <rtcweb@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] Congratuiations on the Cisco announcement - but we still prefer VP8
X-BeenThere: rtcweb@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Real-Time Communication in WEB-browsers working group list <rtcweb.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rtcweb>
List-Post: <mailto:rtcweb@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2013 06:36:06 -0000

On Nov 7, 2013, at 15:19 , Harald Alvestrand <hta@google.com> wrote:

> Re performance, and just so that silence isn't taken as me agreeing with David Singer on this topic:
> 
> I haven't wanted to distract from the debate at hand by tossing more numbers around, but we do think VP8 is significantly better than Baseline. The exchanges with Ericsson have shown that we need to be meticulously clear in defining what we mean by that and how we measure it, so I won't post more numbers until I feel that our description is precise enough.

I also would like to see some tests which tell us where we really are.  A lot of us are engineers who like having facts, even if, as many of us realize, the comparative performance is a minor part of the debate.

I welcome Ericsson's efforts to get clarity in this area; they seem to have been working very hard to get a level playing field measure, and if you can help that effort, this would be all to the good.


David Singer
Multimedia and Software Standards, Apple Inc.

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email