Re: you have running code ... I-D Action: draft-ietf-6man-ipv6only-flag-03.txt

Nick Hilliard <nick@foobar.org> Wed, 31 October 2018 09:24 UTC

Return-Path: <nick@foobar.org>
X-Original-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C410F1298C5 for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 02:24:59 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.201
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UZkiZtmJDw2x for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 02:24:58 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail.netability.ie (mail.netability.ie [IPv6:2a03:8900:0:100::5]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A24F9128D0C for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 02:24:57 -0700 (PDT)
X-Envelope-To: ipv6@ietf.org
Received: from [192.168.2.7] (ppp089210130164.access.hol.gr [89.210.130.164]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.netability.ie (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id w9V8OFvK045764 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 31 Oct 2018 08:24:25 GMT (envelope-from nick@foobar.org)
X-Authentication-Warning: cheesecake.ibn.ie: Host ppp089210130164.access.hol.gr [89.210.130.164] claimed to be [192.168.2.7]
Subject: Re: you have running code ... I-D Action: draft-ietf-6man-ipv6only-flag-03.txt
To: Job Snijders <job@instituut.net>
Cc: bzeeb-lists@lists.zabbadoz.net, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
References: <153973137181.9473.10666616544238076833@ietfa.amsl.com> <6264F7A1-59EB-467D-A576-E5F2F0DEE7DD@lists.zabbadoz.net> <CACWOCC-xL0PfkNHgCqhB28GE-jCWUUagQE4PukdpXK+YHgWpyg@mail.gmail.com>
From: Nick Hilliard <nick@foobar.org>
Message-ID: <97ba35ff-b4a7-314c-3010-297d06be645d@foobar.org>
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2018 11:24:39 +0200
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 PostboxApp/6.1.4
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <CACWOCC-xL0PfkNHgCqhB28GE-jCWUUagQE4PukdpXK+YHgWpyg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/AMkemDJ3pEeMNiFK-AjvsI0bwXQ>
X-BeenThere: ipv6@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "IPv6 Maintenance Working Group \(6man\)" <ipv6.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ipv6/>
List-Post: <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2018 09:25:00 -0000

Job Snijders wrote on 30/10/2018 22:27:
> Can you (or others running FreeBSD EXPERIMENTAL) share reports on how
> this pans out in practise?
Looking at the code, it acts by blocking outbound ipv4 frames from being 
transmitted on ethernet interfaces.  This would mean - for example - 
that if there were a default route already configured on the receiving 
device, any userland code attempting to use ipv4 services would block 
until ARP times out for the default route (default 20 minutes on freebsd).

The only part of the ipv6only discussion that was uncontroversial was 
implementation of the kernel processing side of this flag - there's very 
little to go wrong when toggling a single flag.

The problem area is how to handle the interpretation of this flag in 
userland and in the kernel, which is a much more difficult problem. 
This in turn depends on consensus in 6man about what the flag actually 
means, and there doesn't seem to be much consensus on that.

This also disregards the issue of whether the flag was either necessary 
or a good idea to start with, and nearly 700 emails into this 
discussion, the WG seems to be hopelessly divided on these issues.

Nick