Re: [Ianaplan] A draft for your review

Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> Tue, 02 September 2014 03:35 UTC

Return-Path: <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ianaplan@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ianaplan@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58B6E1A6FC4 for <ianaplan@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 1 Sep 2014 20:35:48 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.7
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 998UUZiF6BVI for <ianaplan@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 1 Sep 2014 20:35:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pd0-x236.google.com (mail-pd0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c02::236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F2B1C1A6FC0 for <ianaplan@ietf.org>; Mon, 1 Sep 2014 20:35:46 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pd0-f182.google.com with SMTP id fp1so7416368pdb.13 for <ianaplan@ietf.org>; Mon, 01 Sep 2014 20:35:46 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=XynD/NpHOu5RmQWpVAoR0fxE+riM2iEz64GxzGHmlAE=; b=G9IvD/As9nWvzVZTH65WfSOT8coa0b3TJSril5E/FG+JdKsYSJka0oNU2V3pYNPaJj MeVwmr5l2TbQDSC+FIK2zF88jjoJ4MfOdLVphnfXK8752Mav2Uon2pZ6HhZ1GeZeMxBu EK0Q4UB/4Wmf6DcfV4MonJ+BiFK64qeuwFueUuAPkPwgdapjJLmFnSfhkMjtTZeu+nx5 P4boZkbO1ek4LvvfqyZjDHSniEZVCoeUuu0gOQmS3DvW1gj+LnHDWWSnwlAAS2pCKaH/ ar/UuWCEmNW+NSwQrBepVyhW9SyfR23LbPj3gYGJTRJ5+y+JId3tAOA//RKIZSVLGBew 6fNw==
X-Received: by 10.66.65.133 with SMTP id x5mr8055924pas.26.1409628946658; Mon, 01 Sep 2014 20:35:46 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.178.23] (229.198.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz. [111.69.198.229]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id or4sm3482753pdb.19.2014.09.01.20.35.44 for <multiple recipients> (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 01 Sep 2014 20:35:45 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <54053B23.7050408@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2014 15:36:03 +1200
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Organization: University of Auckland
User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net>
References: <GLEAIDJPBJDOLEICCGMNCEGACKAA.rhill@hill-a.ch> <5404F631.3030404@gmail.com> <54053194.4040708@meetinghouse.net>
In-Reply-To: <54053194.4040708@meetinghouse.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ianaplan/nM1wYw2cuqrAgULbajoOxLBxy_w
Cc: ianaplan@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ianaplan] A draft for your review
X-BeenThere: ianaplan@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IANA Plan <ianaplan.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ianaplan>, <mailto:ianaplan-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ianaplan/>
List-Post: <mailto:ianaplan@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ianaplan-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ianaplan>, <mailto:ianaplan-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2014 03:35:48 -0000

On 02/09/2014 14:55, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Brian E Carpenter wrote:
>> On 02/09/2014 03:22, Richard Hill wrote:
>> ...
>>
>>> Yes, but, but thus far there has been a contract between NTIA and
>>> ICANN that clearly had precedence over the ICANN bylaws.
>> IANAL, but I find it very hard to believe that a contract can have
>> precedence over the by-laws of a corporation. At the least it suggests
>> a serious failure of due diligence before signing the contract.
>>
>>
> Since it's the NTIA contract that grants ICANN the authority to perform
> the IANA functions, of course it has precedence.  

Sorry, that's a non sequitur. A corporation surely acts according to its
Articles of Incorporation and its By-Laws, and they (probably intentionally)
make no reference to the US Government or any of its agencies, and certainly
not to the NTIA contract. ICANN will not cease to exist, nor will its
charitable purposes change, when that contract lapses.

There was absolutely no consensus in 1998 that NTIA had any authority to
grant ICANN such authority anyway. At the time, everybody involved managed
to hold their noses because ICANN had to be bootstrapped somehow and
there was nothing to be gained by fighting the White House.

> Now, one might argue
> that the contract is in breach, because ICANN signed a contract that's
> in violation of its by-laws, in which case.... <what?>.  But, just
> because ICANN's bylaws says that it has the authority, doesn't mean it
> does.

True. Which is why the IAB and IETF worked hard to get an MoU signed,
to consolidate the above bootstrap. Personally, I felt that ICANN was
on very shaky ground until 10 March 2000 when its Board ratified
the MoU. Until that moment, the IETF and IAB could have walked away
in a heartbeat. There were off-shore copies of all the existing
IANA allocations just in case.

   Brian