Re: Updating BCP 10 -- NomCom

Michael StJohns <mstjohns@comcast.net> Thu, 08 January 2015 18:54 UTC

Return-Path: <mstjohns@comcast.net>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5436E1A8F4A for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 8 Jan 2015 10:54:50 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.513
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.513 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, MISSING_MID=0.497, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oyJkF5tJYrit for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 8 Jan 2015 10:54:48 -0800 (PST)
Received: from resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe16:19:96:114:154:171]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9A8771A8F43 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Thu, 8 Jan 2015 10:54:48 -0800 (PST)
Received: from resomta-po-02v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.226]) by resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id dWuk1p0054tLnxL01WuoKK; Thu, 08 Jan 2015 18:54:48 +0000
Received: from Mike-T530ssd.comcast.net ([69.255.115.150]) by resomta-po-02v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id dWum1p0043Em2Kp01Wum14; Thu, 08 Jan 2015 18:54:47 +0000
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.1.0.9
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2015 13:55:04 -0500
To: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>, Eric Burger <eburger@cs.georgetown.edu>, ietf <ietf@ietf.org>
From: Michael StJohns <mstjohns@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Updating BCP 10 -- NomCom
In-Reply-To: <20038FAABC32083290783A97@JcK-HP8200.jck.com>
References: <CAL0qLwZk=k-CWLte_ChK9f1kzLwMOTRyi7AwFa8fLjBsextBcA@mail.gmail.com> <D54C3DE17A3E5C7B032F6FB4@JcK-HP8200.jck.com> <BC1A05C1-6198-4325-8F46-8E5AB9D0DFCF@cs.georgetown.edu> <20038FAABC32083290783A97@JcK-HP8200.jck.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1420743288; bh=mleuUll/54jWmN5UIeZoo6hF0dkSIXKsBGsOISJMWHs=; h=Received:Received:Date:To:From:Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type; b=pJEqP6WRv3Anzw7f5KaY+FWmn53lPlbLWjxQ9B8gjtmjB8Is0Lji8wz4aiMWYZARI hvUWvtvvQw8NQ4NnyXrDFAWlNzt31c7szgAs4AgneQzSKOAeYICA69ysE0kGohxASC +gPDoSWnbAZFvN5ozajrsuFPqQJgPDvWwYb/Dv3Orl9zqJJwrFcJ1VkgaRuKPjbafW 0CPcqXQYjJlly2nXnG1cR6BTZuIWk1/FhLg89oWVD0GaUDTVztXFCCJPm5TW90cKUj kuw7sbFos5rX7o51sKZqMI+yyenmVei1RxCBGuyi1Aiy+tRORBT5Ft7z0YfNcQtGQM kOPITSZQ57PWQ==
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/_7EDqGcF46yBzFSZ3GELurV7iQQ>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2015 18:54:50 -0000
X-Message-ID:
Message-ID: <20150108185453.8832.59400.ARCHIVE@ietfa.amsl.com>

At 11:32 AM 1/8/2015, John C Klensin wrote:
>For example and in the hope of being a bit less vague, I
>personally see no need for liaisons to sit in on candidate
>interviews, to see supposedly-confidential candidate
>questionnaires, to see community input about particular
>candidates, or to participate in Nomcom discussions or be
>exposed to correspondence about particular candidates or
>candidate choice rankings.  And I see some disadvantages to the
>quality and breadth of input the Nomcom is likely to receive to
>their doing so. Do you disagree?


Hi John -

Speaking only to the above, during the Nomcom I ran, I found it useful to pair up the interviewers and used every resource available.  That meant that liaisons participated in the process of asking questions and fleshing out the material we had already gathered from the questionnaires.   We always gave the candidates the option to ask for other interviewers, but AIRC, no one did.

99% of the information on the questionnaire is going to be publicly sourceable I would guess, most of the rest of the information that might be confidential is ephemeral (e.g. candidate A is in the process of looking for a job).

Of course at the time, the actual names of the candidates were seen as confidential.

AFAIK, it's the job of the Chair to prevent Liaisons from exerting undue influence on the process, and I understand that there have been issues in the past where the influence went past the bounds.  That said, the liaisons are likely to have more and relevant information on more of the candidates than the 10 people picked at random from the IETF as a whole.  Failure to use that resource would - IMHO - result in a worst result, not a better one.  Community input is all fine and good, but it has the same bias problems that you get with self-selected surveys.

That is a long way of saying, that yes I disagree.

Later, Mike