Re: [77attendees] Ad hoc meetings (Was: Re: Bar BoF: ip traceback)

Melinda Shore <shore@arsc.edu> Mon, 29 March 2010 17:53 UTC

Return-Path: <shore@arsc.edu>
X-Original-To: 77attendees@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: 77attendees@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DD353A6B2E for <77attendees@core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 29 Mar 2010 10:53:53 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.019
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.019 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-1.11, DNS_FROM_OPENWHOIS=1.13, NO_RELAYS=-0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GMGhgWR1+HZZ for <77attendees@core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 29 Mar 2010 10:53:52 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from arsc.edu (mail1.arsc.edu [IPv6:2001:480:150:75::229]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B8743A6B2C for <77attendees@ietf.org>; Mon, 29 Mar 2010 10:53:49 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from viking-e0.arsc.edu (viking-e0.arsc.edu [IPv6:2001:480:150:860:223:32ff:feda:4a52]) by arsc.edu (20090828.ARSC) with ESMTP id o2THs5MX008732; Mon, 29 Mar 2010 09:54:06 -0800 (AKDT)
Message-Id: <2E26D729-0A4F-47AD-ADBD-684C553A6230@arsc.edu>
From: Melinda Shore <shore@arsc.edu>
To: Jari Arkko <jari.arkko@piuha.net>
In-Reply-To: <4BB0552B.4010106@piuha.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"; format="flowed"; delsp="yes"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v936)
Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 09:54:05 -0800
References: <4BA8BCE3.5020309@is.naist.jp> <4BA95B6A.5040707@is.naist.jp><4BAB0464.2010307@is.naist.jp> <4BAB7A4D.7070904@piuha.net> <8133D17D-D9B6-40A6-AE9B-80BF90A5223D@checkpoint.com> <050005AF2D0F493AB38639A33748E8D6@china.huawei.com> <8B0A9FCBB9832F43971E38010638454F03E24ED320@SISPE7MB1.commscope.com> <4BABD0B2.9050003@piuha.net> <4BABDB19.8060403@gmail.com> <027f01cacc69$4847ae10$d8d70a30$@org> <23E6E51A-5D3B-4F94-B32F-7F3545003E03@cisco.com> <53720E57-D96D-458A-8178-5CC3DB496FAD@nokia.com> <4BB0552B.4010106@piuha.net>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.936)
X-CanIt-Geo: No geolocation information available for 2001:480:150:860:223:32ff:feda:4a52
X-CanItPRO-Stream: default
X-Canit-Stats-ID: Bayes signature not available
X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . roaringpenguin . com) on IPv6:2001:480:150:75::167
Cc: "'Thomson, Martin'" <Martin.Thomson@andrew.com>, "77attendees@ietf.org" <77attendees@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [77attendees] Ad hoc meetings (Was: Re: Bar BoF: ip traceback)
X-BeenThere: 77attendees@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: <77attendees.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/77attendees>, <mailto:77attendees-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/77attendees>
List-Post: <mailto:77attendees@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:77attendees-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/77attendees>, <mailto:77attendees-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 17:53:53 -0000

On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:22 PM, Jari Arkko wrote:
> Secondly, as Brian pointed out there is also an aspect of fairness  
> and openness. Maybe you *want* to find other like minded people that  
> you didn't already know. And those people may want to participate.  
> So I'm not sure the answer is closed meetings, either.

Right.  I think keeping the process as open as possible
should be a goal and question whether the current rather formal
"informal" structure doesn't actually tend to make the process
less participatory rather than more participatory, since the
presentation format tends to draw lines between the people
presenting, and the "audience."  I'd like to see informal
gatherings stay as informal as possible, including not being
able to use IETF meeting A/V equipment.  I also think Scott's
point about the bar <har har har> on BOF approval being so
high as to create incentives for people to do the semi-formal
bar BOF thing is well-taken and merits serious consideration.

Melinda