Re: Terminology discussion threads
Nico Williams <nico@cryptonector.com> Thu, 13 August 2020 18:35 UTC
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Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2020 13:35:45 -0500
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From: Nico Williams <nico@cryptonector.com>
To: "Scott O. Bradner" <sob@sobco.com>
Cc: IETF Sergeant-at-Arms <saa@ietf.org>, ietf <ietf@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: Terminology discussion threads
Message-ID: <20200813183544.GF3100@localhost>
References: <9ABDC2BC-E6A3-4249-99C5-F0BB3683A03D@ietf.org> <223A1539-30B0-424A-89D1-A968FFD4C140@symbolic.software> <aceec35c-ccc8-ccca-7a5b-7d23746f67e2@ietf.org> <A9BB633C-3278-406C-BD38-748646D7E454@symbolic.software> <C4BC10B5-6F65-451F-8B15-98AA8D54966A@ietf.org> <E903D378-9FA6-44B7-BDDA-3D283F73039D@sobco.com>
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On Thu, Aug 13, 2020 at 01:27:31PM -0400, Scott O. Bradner wrote: > I consider this an abuse of your presumed authority The IETF has been abusing its SAA function these past few years. Download the list archive and search for posts by the SAA and the reactions to them over the past two years and you should see at least to previous incidents where the SAA went beyond its remit. We also had an AD who very inappropriately doubled as SAA -- those who serve as SAAs should not serve in any other leadership capacity, and this should be a hard rule. The pattern seems to be that once the SAA crosses the line the community chastises the SAA and then the SAA goes quiet for a year or so. This means that every time the SAA goes beyond its remit the SAA function loses authority and ceases to function effectively. Now having three examples of this, might the SAA will learn their lesson finally? Or maybe since they insist on misbehaving, the SAA staff should be replaced. > in no way should an expression of disapproval of an IESG action be > considered as a continuation of the discussion that caused the IESG > action It's rather unseemly, isn't it, to allow expressions of approval and disallow expressions of disapproval. Either the very first expression of approval should have met with SAA action on account of the Chair's silence! order, or no expressions of disapproval of the Chair's order should have met with SAA action. At most only continued debate should have met with SAA action. Nico --
- Terminology discussion threads IETF Chair
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Lars Eggert
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Richard Barnes
- Re: Terminology discussion threads David Schinazi
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Wendy Seltzer
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Eric Rescorla
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Dan Harkins
- RE: Terminology discussion threads STARK, BARBARA H
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Melinda Shore
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Ted Hardie
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Suresh Krishnan
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Lloyd Wood
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Sergeant-at-Arms
- Re: Terminology discussion threads (CORRECTION) Sergeant-at-Arms
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Masataka Ohta
- Re: Terminology discussion threads IETF Sergeant at Arms
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Martin Duke
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Dan Harkins
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nadim Kobeissi
- Re: Terminology discussion threads IETF Sergeant at Arms
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nadim Kobeissi
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Ofer Inbar
- RE: Terminology discussion threads STARK, BARBARA H
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nadim Kobeissi
- Re: Terminology discussion threads IETF Sergeant-at-Arms
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Scott O. Bradner
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Richard Barnes
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Melinda Shore
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nico Williams
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Eric Heflin
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Charlie Perkins
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Kyle Rose
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nico Williams
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Bob Hinden
- Re: Terminology discussion threads David Schinazi
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Keith Moore
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Scott O. Bradner
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Leif Johansson
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Randy Bush
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Toerless Eckert
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Carlos M. Martinez
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Toerless Eckert
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Michael StJohns
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Richard Barnes
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Leif Johansson
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Brian E Carpenter
- SaA Team actions (was: Re: Terminology discussion… John C Klensin
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Michael StJohns
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Melinda Shore
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Carsten Bormann
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Rob Sayre
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nadim Kobeissi
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Bron Gondwana
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Warren Kumari
- On plenary functions Eliot Lear
- Re: On plenary functions Carsten Bormann
- Re: On plenary functions Jay Daley
- Re: On plenary functions Carsten Bormann
- Re: On plenary functions Brian E Carpenter
- Re: On plenary functions Eliot Lear
- Re: On plenary functions Keith Moore
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Miles Fidelman
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Keith Moore
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Patrik Fältström
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nico Williams
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Toerless Eckert
- Re: Terminology discussion threads S Moonesamy
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nico Williams
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Pete Resnick
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Toerless Eckert
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nick Hilliard
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Michael StJohns
- Re: Terminology discussion threads IETF Chair
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nico Williams
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Alissa Cooper
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Richard Barnes
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Paul Hoffman
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Paul Hoffman
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Paul Wouters
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Eric Rescorla
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Christian Huitema
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: Terminology discussion threads (off-topic) S Moonesamy
- Re: Terminology discussion threads (off-topic) Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: Terminology discussion threads (off-topic) S Moonesamy
- Re: Terminology discussion threads tom petch
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Carlos M. Martinez
- Re: Terminology discussion threads tom petch
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Dan Harkins
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Nico Williams
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Keith Moore
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Jared Mauch
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Mary B
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Dan Harkins
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Jen Linkova
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Fernando Gont
- RE: Terminology discussion threads Larry Masinter
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Carsten Bormann
- Self-moderation Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Self-moderation Mary B
- Re: Self-moderation Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: Self-moderation Warren Kumari
- Re: Self-moderation John C Klensin
- Re: Self-moderation Stewart Bryant
- Re: Self-moderation Carsten Bormann
- Re: Self-moderation John C Klensin
- Re: Self-moderation John Levine
- Re: Self-moderation Warren Kumari
- Weekly message summaries John Levine
- Re: Weekly message summaries Töma Gavrichenkov
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Martin Thomson
- Re: Terminology discussion threads S Moonesamy
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Jay Daley
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Mary B
- Re: Terminology discussion threads Toerless Eckert
- Re: Terminology discussion threads S Moonesamy