Re: [v6ops] ULA draft revision #2 Regarding isolated networks

Tim Chown <tjc@ecs.soton.ac.uk> Tue, 27 May 2014 15:19 UTC

Return-Path: <tjc@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01AF61A0428 for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 27 May 2014 08:19:49 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.871
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.871 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5dL1qUVb-ffe for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 27 May 2014 08:19:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from falcon.ecs.soton.ac.uk (falcon.ecs.soton.ac.uk [IPv6:2001:630:d0:f102::25e]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7F1B61A0168 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Tue, 27 May 2014 08:19:46 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from falcon.ecs.soton.ac.uk (localhost.ecs.soton.ac.uk [127.0.0.1]) by falcon.ecs.soton.ac.uk (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id s4RFJWZF017006; Tue, 27 May 2014 16:19:32 +0100
X-DKIM: Sendmail DKIM Filter v2.8.2 falcon.ecs.soton.ac.uk s4RFJWZF017006
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=simple/simple; d=ecs.soton.ac.uk; s=201304; t=1401203973; bh=R53/ryuSzB9uh9U737HgqwAu6rw=; h=Mime-Version:Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References:To; b=OB6g0/lpjuxxqZIVNYCEtRSgR0Y0R91bDgCSr6rn+7g7YkIfLzyVmybOWKIAMRI2G lO5jQ5gsgk0RRfxbbKK7NWBk9N7jyIDLF2qvLwOfvHtAph1/QmZTm30R+g4POXefoR HbMpGv2NuiBoblqNTn90UEmRbpwdOPFQTJ4+DAsk=
Received: from gander.ecs.soton.ac.uk ([2001:630:d0:f102:250:56ff:fea0:401]) by falcon.ecs.soton.ac.uk (falcon.ecs.soton.ac.uk [2001:630:d0:f102:250:56ff:fea0:68da]) envelope-from <tjc@ecs.soton.ac.uk> with ESMTP (valid=N/A) id q4QGJW0546013678YX ret-id none; Tue, 27 May 2014 16:19:33 +0100
Received: from tjc-vpn.ecs.soton.ac.uk (tjc-vpn.ecs.soton.ac.uk [152.78.236.241]) (authenticated bits=0) by gander.ecs.soton.ac.uk (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id s4RFJVlk024112 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Tue, 27 May 2014 16:19:32 +0100
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_E39499A1-1813-4F66-916E-8ECE58873777"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.2\))
From: Tim Chown <tjc@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
In-Reply-To: <1CFC65A0-22E6-4D2B-BA01-D5F4C0E17BAC@nominum.com>
Date: Tue, 27 May 2014 16:19:31 +0100
Message-ID: <EMEW3|f4336f51cd080ebcfc6c88f5a0e6f2f9q4QGJW03tjc|ecs.soton.ac.uk|E85DE270-3F21-457C-B4AA-BDB48C332D67@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
References: <8AE0F17B87264D4CAC7DE0AA6C406F453D8B6B9A@nkgeml506-mbx.china.huawei.com> <m261ks7xww.wl%randy@psg.com> <53840070.90801@gmail.com> <m2y4xn7wep.wl%randy@psg.com> <53840723.8010606@gmail.com> <CAKD1Yr1O_poMR200sjU=ttRvGaeQRkC1ZfXC0Ok4uQxdq3K=NQ@mail.gmail.com> <m2mwe37tbn.wl%randy@psg.com> <CAKD1Yr2t3-vxuG=iDi4biBNFpJwuzuHgfpB74i_uydWWRV7qZg@mail.gmail.com> <8AE0F17B87264D4CAC7DE0AA6C406F453D8B6E02@nkgeml506-mbx.china.huawei.com> <m2fvjv7q4h.wl%randy@psg.com> <m1WpDcc-0000BMC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <43BB867C-7BCA-45F6-8ADC-A49B34D6C0DC@nominum.com> <5384937A.90409@foobar.org> <1CFC65A0-22E6-4D2B-BA01-D5F4C0E17BAC@nominum.com> <E85DE270-3F21-457C-B4AA-BDB48C332D67@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
To: Ted Lemon <ted.lemon@nominum.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.2)
X-smtpf-Report: sid=q4QGJW054601367800; tid=q4QGJW0546013678YX; client=relay,forged,no_ptr,ipv6; mail=; rcpt=; nrcpt=4:0; fails=0
X-ECS-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information
X-ECS-MailScanner-ID: s4RFJWZF017006
X-ECS-MailScanner: Found to be clean
X-ECS-MailScanner-From: tjc@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/73GGEnGwNHraGq9U3ALZgo3NOZE
Cc: Philip Homburg <pch-v6ops-3a@u-1.phicoh.com>, v6ops WG <v6ops@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] ULA draft revision #2 Regarding isolated networks
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 May 2014 15:19:49 -0000

On 27 May 2014, at 14:59, Ted Lemon <ted.lemon@nominum.com> wrote:

> On May 27, 2014, at 9:30 AM, Nick Hilliard <nick@foobar.org> wrote:
>> or use NAT.  I'm not saying this in order to throw fuel on an existing
>> fire, but simply because this is the reality for many organisations in the
>> ipv4 world, and I see little reason why it will change for ipv6.  The IETF
>> can make recommendations about whether it thinks this is a good idea or
>> not, but it is not productive to pretend that the elephant isn't in the room.
> 
> Right, the point is that if we provide advice on how to set up ULA networks so that future transitions of this sort do not require NAT, that's worth doing.   Actually, for the enterprise scenario, I think the advice should just be "get a GUA, use it like a ULA" because that excludes the possibility of a future clash when two behemoths merge.   But it makes source address selection harder.   And there was a document a while back about informal ULA registries, IIRC, which could also represent a good mitigation strategy if it were to happen (but I think that's outside our scope of work).

The enterprise IPv6 incremental deployment text is just going up for publication, see http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-v6ops-enterprise-incremental-ipv6-05.
That pretty much captures what Ted says, but also points to the draft under discussion here.  See section 2.6 in particular.

Tim

> _______________________________________________
> v6ops mailing list
> v6ops@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops