Re: draft-bourbaki-6man-classless-ipv6-00

Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> Sun, 11 June 2017 01:46 UTC

Return-Path: <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8A6E1294B3 for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 10 Jun 2017 18:46:57 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Qh-0Mv1Wo9-8 for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 10 Jun 2017 18:46:56 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pg0-x231.google.com (mail-pg0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c05::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2B77A1294B2 for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Sat, 10 Jun 2017 18:46:56 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pg0-x231.google.com with SMTP id a70so35907641pge.3 for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Sat, 10 Jun 2017 18:46:56 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:organization:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=o01fn6xL7GDlhAHTw+UGxBEmskydOSurPQqYeWdrAxw=; b=exfc3Ax2P98l4utOA05BnN4KMv126gCrar6WPaz2Y4CYtw8QrY1x0Pr0rkQifVgibZ IdXsSfOAtlyFxjrhuOduWyQRP+P9mr1NWrG0yeEt2XqFtHIsff++DGn3jtQSMb6T1omn /7/lVvR1/eUblLthZrFQX+fx6c3Moh9MGhICFLTjgdwxpsZ1GuiSMzAa2aHATp3foHjo Q3DN1ThM6UEmHlH48/FQHhk8awvMkJU3/3xT7fbjcQ2uaXoJh3sL0KHIDtJv4nEOykUy 8CUgRkGGOJxQddjhRsOSce4vJdSTwi96ZCEAybM140MiXgu18J2le3fogOzxF04Lqrnk dfMQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:organization :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=o01fn6xL7GDlhAHTw+UGxBEmskydOSurPQqYeWdrAxw=; b=b3sKO8G/wtWj3LIc4RtqXjPx2OH9Zy0Dk9ObKs7NpSPz28Auif9RbevbXLkQlfoIEY ooxJdqb0WrTf1bqQbnb8W0NJ/G7ZnHL8q4jas75XA6DsdGUSYF9GjGR/GEz9gWJMOtaU Es4hMGb8m4HfQyJzjQA3mWM7Zo0LDOcaWn9o3NftG8Zs+VtMfIDRh3lfa+XCuUaZJJO+ KJKRY3E4fcnr5lVzq65TX5bUVsyLfAnekYxcpT/3WHW7gATrGN8YCNHC5D3bqgo5Pp3f ytUdnD9wBT0YBUaXNX+6TRVqmA5ktnEmn/ARN++2K08zX5+yaFqcUDmveqI96t3K/P2B za2Q==
X-Gm-Message-State: AODbwcCtwCWZfbWSBRGCrQpvXb3ufH8iirfru894crpcbgDpOFMA0deM rn00uCUFnYHQ0sl6
X-Received: by 10.98.27.215 with SMTP id b206mr15844286pfb.123.1497145615533; Sat, 10 Jun 2017 18:46:55 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ?IPv6:2406:e001:541b:1:28cc:dc4c:9703:6781? ([2406:e001:541b:1:28cc:dc4c:9703:6781]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r73sm10664292pfk.114.2017.06.10.18.46.53 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 10 Jun 2017 18:46:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: draft-bourbaki-6man-classless-ipv6-00
To: "Manfredi, Albert E" <albert.e.manfredi@boeing.com>
Cc: 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
References: <20170602141112.x64nleqclygz7dwd@Vurt.local> <CAKD1Yr3ppM0UF8HoN8PgS7F0iEmK26ebiuJK=tkAdZnuLWpkZg@mail.gmail.com> <CAKFn1SHASt34ihJmGN0iRFQQzLTMspZfxXHgBjBatXXcRYF4cw@mail.gmail.com> <20170604093119.nt733rb3ymmjssww@Vurt.local> <m1dHTLx-0000DcC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <CAKD1Yr0ZZwRar6D-2bkXBKPYehqqW99+BMtDOjyovR8WDXKzxw@mail.gmail.com> <CAD6AjGTjikAWutcenW8qn7OW8kPM9c_x_yDUy5vQxJmXKL85dg@mail.gmail.com> <91c3c0f4-eb8b-cdf7-b9c9-7d1eecb7fe64@gmail.com> <CAKD1Yr0_WR_TB+OC0U1Qt2h6WzUp9EGvrqC1ZKW2mwFeBd3bCQ@mail.gmail.com> <4021a559-5b6d-b3fb-19cd-afbe9041e8f2@gmail.com> <34A29D4D-3670-40BC-B62E-85C4EABC55D5@employees.org> <6e03e25e-fd6a-6311-390e-4834281a76f7@si6networks.com> <1B580CBB-B29D-4860-9EC8-BECD1D5E0006@employees.org> <4b2f5200-86a1-7711-e5ff-7436572be467@gmail.com> <E02C4C99-155A-4358-A845-F00F8BB071C1@employees.org> <b3ca5271-21b1-ab33-2dff-82735ebe9128@gmail.com> <235143da452c4ff4aec39a26ba918e7e@XCH15-06-11.nw.nos.boeing.com>
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Organization: University of Auckland
Message-ID: <1489a50a-2616-f9ac-4109-16c595e15f90@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2017 13:46:50 +1200
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.1.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <235143da452c4ff4aec39a26ba918e7e@XCH15-06-11.nw.nos.boeing.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/xgpL3UNlNrmPFfSjAalKCwGoT5U>
X-BeenThere: ipv6@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: "IPv6 Maintenance Working Group \(6man\)" <ipv6.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ipv6/>
List-Post: <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2017 01:46:58 -0000

On 11/06/2017 12:00, Manfredi, Albert E wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ipv6 [mailto:ipv6-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian E Carpenter
> 
>>> If we remove the 64 bit boundary from 4291, then an update of 2464
>>> will likely result in the removal of any bit boundary there as well.
>>
>> No, for the out-of-the-box reason. I can't see any practical
>> alternative to a fixed length per link type.
> 
> I think there are practical alternatives, so I too would suggest not to state flatly that SLAAC requires fixed length IIDs. Anything that requires RAs to work can make adjustments to its IID, in real time.

It cannot adjust its IID length when assigning itself a link-local address *before*
receiving any RA/PIO messages. But whatever length N of IID it uses to generate its
LL address must match the the prefix length 128-N in a later RA/PIO with A=1.
Otherwise, SLAAC fails.

(see Section 5.5.3 bullet d of RFC4862, as Jinmei-san kindly explained to me.)

So in fact the only thing that works is if the equipment assumes the same IID length
as the router announces (as 128-N). Therefore, N must be predefined.
 
> ULAs and link local would need to create IIDs with no knowledge of the outside world. But not SLAAC.

ULAs have nothing to do with it; SLAAC doesn't care whether a prefix is ULA or
globally reachable. And LL is *not* independent of SLAAC.

Regards
    Brian