IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: Evolving Documents (nee "Living Documents") side meeting at IETF105.)

Christopher Morrow <morrowc.lists@gmail.com> Sat, 20 July 2019 13:00 UTC

Return-Path: <christopher.morrow@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC019120ABB for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 20 Jul 2019 06:00:14 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.998
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 51kUs_hdwyP1 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 20 Jul 2019 06:00:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-qt1-x831.google.com (mail-qt1-x831.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::831]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 43233120089 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Sat, 20 Jul 2019 06:00:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-qt1-x831.google.com with SMTP id d23so33930741qto.2 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Sat, 20 Jul 2019 06:00:13 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=PI5lrpXaOcQ8D4d5Rml80d8QFdxVy3uxBhXc4UTMXFY=; b=A+zYm/3BJMeDsHdIDXu5z5b0iizVol8GChARLVkwU2lCr0kVFHVcSixBVQgV1zjz37 Mvb6cIW88FeRp+t4Geb0HeNIYNqTulDN7bLGWj/BpmEuWD7qI6zDfOhhZuVhTbYKwGnF s/F1wZQDkMx3XWUqaw29mJNbrz12ayK/Jot39pyIF8u0FVy0M2sCUDm5RhhIT3lnxr8+ HEQ+mxC69zspOHvOksxVFzMjBS8A8CkSESHeTP3zwvqx2wO41Hk0qTvQUGgJ6bXusz/S I/wf1P0LZtZwEv71dCkMAEUNcZz34B4mvY7S0Ciq918xKurGidLKsgxdhpwovuaV0LDv GnRg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=PI5lrpXaOcQ8D4d5Rml80d8QFdxVy3uxBhXc4UTMXFY=; b=paYyDiZsYeUNUtuRz4nXnDYnZwqyHkzkEbFYuMPgOIEBvhhws66QErlVRnZkFXCUum Wx7m3wV9tlQvzqMTDnfSAuxxc/b0OPU4HIUpVmTUz4MWXxJ8KExOcZWDYyeUUdtOVqvy V0aFfEDCKU0KfUUjo0lDfZpYusK3qK8MMrWoXqAhvb4R6C2ANWj0XCeV+927GilVYQP9 OUYRvzeZMNfjWxOiXm2wt7dIEcItfgF4ONt1j/fBOzYAw00mfHIHa3q7+HCo7/2YwO3P vg56RSS8UNlR1RNHQul1ALYETqe8/4m2fIIXJo0BqsFSyxNKUDhlqzr0BY17c0Tk3J+F ZQNg==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU4d9E6AVJcQluqIu31alGCao7LkRaSFW4NLevrB2Ege/WLiLoe pWU5wsyE7cZFx4S8k14KxzqG8TYDNT4Z8yJxT/cfDqZ5nJA=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqydodD9hiCRVUUBL4gTNf9kNvRPWfsL6g9JSn2ZILhbjmPtAsAIpKDATG8wAavk+FFK5zyTB7NuN6n6j8uKQQQ=
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:142:: with SMTP id f2mr41407264qtg.336.1563627611887; Sat, 20 Jul 2019 06:00:11 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <F2D5DCCF-4051-444B-9522-9E11F9F93005@fugue.com> <869599E9-7571-4677-AB9A-961027549C54@network-heretics.com> <144ff436-a7a2-22f7-7b06-4d0b3bcfefac@joelhalpern.com> <20190719041456.GL33367@vurt.meerval.net> <254fc5f6-3576-a62f-b84f-a7c5d29b0055@joelhalpern.com> <a1561aa7-5f41-0e2a-1892-cfb587196ac0@gmail.com> <C3D53639-C2C0-42CE-9708-99294091E012@puck.nether.net> <a17a8648-14c8-1889-4ee3-86996ff6281e@gmail.com> <3B0C189A-D56B-430F-82FF-19DE0DC788DE@puck.nether.net> <BA80E73F53C26B9191294131@JcK-HP5.jck.com> <20190719190534.GG38674@shrubbery.net> <7FF2DA2F2DC64741DA8B5747@JcK-HP5.jck.com> <CAHw9_iL-9D1EFZcXp6twK+WL137F5zArLcUrJw50Q-YL0PBpag@mail.gmail.com> <b0015262-b009-90a8-aaed-c2dd175706cf@network-heretics.com>
In-Reply-To: <b0015262-b009-90a8-aaed-c2dd175706cf@network-heretics.com>
From: Christopher Morrow <morrowc.lists@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2019 08:59:59 -0400
Message-ID: <CAL9jLaZdQpn=KNHbTZJL=RcV4Jzw=AWUTC2LsY1+fBUcTajBoA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Evolving Documents (nee "Living Documents") side meeting at IETF105.)
To: Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com>
Cc: ietf <ietf@ietf.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/3dNkZxadmMXx6VO1z_ggQvOfwZw>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2019 13:00:15 -0000

On Sat, Jul 20, 2019 at 8:51 AM Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com> wrote:
> I believe your statement of intent.  But I think it's fair to realize
> that there is already tremendous pressure to deploy implementations
> before they've been formally approved, and there's a danger that any
> kind of distinguished "mark" will have the (unintended) effect of
> promoting deployment of the marked version of a protocol.

regardless of 'published or not' folk will always push for the early
implementation of FOO before it has been 'ratified'.
it's pretty clear that this happens, and that nothing about this
discussion is going to change that.

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email