Re: [v6ops] reclassify 464XLAT as standard instead of info

["Rajiv Asati (rajiva)" <[e-mail]>]

Pls see inline,


> On Sep 23, 2017, at 3:23 AM, Mark Andrews <[e-mail]> wrote:
> 
> 
> In message <CAD6AjGSs2K4zFWX8tpeS+r3FJCu=w4JuOjLHy=[e-mail]>
> , Ca By writes:
>> On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 5:45 AM Rajiv Asati (rajiva) <[e-mail]>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> I don't think that there any iOS app that is not IPv6-only compatible
>>> (since the apple AppStore mandate more than a year* ago). Is there one ?
>>> 
>> 
>> I am simply here to disabuse you of the notion that this rule has been
>> perfect for the folks involved.
>> 
>> 
>>> If Google playstore could mandate something similar (perhaps, there is one
>>> that I am not aware of), then almost all mobile UEs can happily live with v
>> 6-only
>>> without any Clat function.  Better battery life, likely.
>>> 
>> 
>> Fully agree. What if Google playstore cannot / will not enforce such a rule
>> ?  We in v6ops / sunset4  are well aware that asking for a poney seldom
>> results in a poney .... hence warty solutions that thread one needle to
>> move another needle. Putting the E back into IETF.
>> 
>> 
>>> Hence, There is no need for XLAT being a BCP at this time in that regard.
>>> 
>>> Of course, NAT64 inside the network would still be needed to accommodate
>>> the smaller  (% of traffic) v4-only internet connectivity. But that's an
>>> ongoing saga of another debate.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> However, there is one exception - tethering ::
>>> 
> 
> DS-Lite accomodates tethering.  

So do 464XLAT, MAP-T/E etc. i agree. 
However, the point was that CLAT function wouldn't be needed unless tethering was enabled (assuming apps were v6 compatible). 

Cheers,
Rajiv

> It's in millions of broadband CPE devices
> today 'tethering' the home IPv4 network to the rest of the world over IPv6
> access networks.
> 
>> Ah. What little control we have.
>> 
>> 
>>> if mobile UE is tethered and the other devices connecting to its W/LAN are
>>> stuck in legacy v4-only, then mobile ISPs might prefer to not leave them
>>> behind to ensure customer experience. What "technical" options do we have
>>> then? Well, really two == Let go of v6-only access (provide an IPv4-only
>>> APN if tethering is enabled resulting in a dual-stack UE) or stick with
>>> v6-only access, but turn on CLAT function !!
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Rajiv
>>> 
>>> 
>>> * https://developer.apple.com/support/ipv6/
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Sep 22, 2017, at 8:22 AM, Gert Doering <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 02:17:55PM +0200, Ole Troan wrote:
>>> 
>>> On 22 Sep 2017, at 13:48, Gert Doering <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 05:07:19PM +1000, Mark Andrews wrote:
>>> 
>>> IPv6 applications need to add code to WORKAROUND breakages caused
>>> 
>>> by NAT64 the way they need add WORKAROUNDS for the NAT breakages
>>> 
>>> even if they are not using NAT64 or NAT respectively.  The cancer
>>> 
>>> that is NAT64 needs to be eradicated.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> It will nicely go away if all endpoints are reachable over v6.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I think that?fs the concern. That it will not.
>>> 
>>> IPv6 applications will have code to accommodate for NAT64 forever.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Yeah, but you can't have the cake and eat it.  Either we go v6-only
>>> everywhere, or we keep running IPv4 everywhere until everybody else
>>> is done, or we introduce v4/v6 NATs, or we add a CLAT to every single
>>> operating system out there.
>>> 
>>> What's it gonna be, boys?
>>> 
>>> (Oh, "or we give up, roll back existing v6 deployments, and live happy
>>> with v4 nat forever".  FAR less work, and for Joe Average User, it won't
>>> make a difference.  Facebook and Youtube will continue to work, and
>>> their IoT devices will keep drilling holes into firewalls to ensure that
>>> they can be exploited no matter what)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Gert Doering
>>>       -- NetMaster
>>> --
>>> have you enabled IPv6 on something today...?
>>> 
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> -- 
> Mark Andrews, ISC
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