Re: Harassment, abuse, accountability. and IETF mailing lists

[Benjamin Kaduk <[e-mail]>]

Hi John,

Trimming judiciously, as I am not prepared to comment on all the points you
raise.

On Thu, Jun 02, 2022 at 11:26:32PM -0400, John C Klensin wrote:
> 
> (1) If someone is feeling abused or harassed in conjunction with
> an IETF mailing list, they should have readily-available
> information about who to discuss that with.  That person, or
> choice of people, should have clear responsibility for
> responding to such queries and should be identified by name and
> contact information.   Non-transparent role addresses with
> neither hints about who might receive them nor a clear
> indication that they should be used for such purposes are not
> good enough.  For the (hopefully rare) cases in which action is
> required, those contact people should have either the authority
> needed to enforce our behavior rules or quick access to someone
> with the authority and should be accountable to someone if they
> do not respond in a timely and useful way.

This is not exactly an answer to your question as written, but I believe
that it is always okay to approach an arbitrary AD with concerns of this
nature, and the AD should be able to help locate the appropriate authority
figure.  An arbitrary AD can be selected so as to be uninvolved from any
particular controversy, known to be particularly conscientious, etc.

> 
> Now, let's look at those very important pages from which, among
> other things, one ought to be able to find out who is on said
> hook and, btw, what the list is about.
> 
> * For a typical WG one, the Chairs and AD are listed, but
> without contact information (just a pointer/link to a
> datatracker profile page that does not have that information).
> I believe that is a change although I don't have any idea how
> long ago it was made.   If the observer knows enough to click on

I'm really confused.
Are you talking about the WG lists as listed at
https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/?  I see links to profile pages, yes, which
includes a table of role/group/email entries, with the email addresses
right there -- I am not sure why you say "does not have that information"
(perhaps you are looking at a different page than I am?).

Interestingly, the list of WGs does include direct mailto: links (the
envelope icon after the name) to the responsible AD, but does not have
those for the chairs.  Perhaps that's the change you're thinking of?

-Ben