Re: Bad/Good ideas and damage control by experienced participants

Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com> Wed, 15 June 2022 19:58 UTC

Return-Path: <moore@network-heretics.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBD9CC15AAD5 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 15 Jun 2022 12:58:43 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -8.804
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-8.804 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-1.876, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_NONE=0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UPGCPqSmUj4a for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 15 Jun 2022 12:58:39 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com (out4-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.28]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E438FC15AAD0 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 15 Jun 2022 12:58:38 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from compute4.internal (compute4.nyi.internal [10.202.2.44]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EEC65C012B for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 15 Jun 2022 15:58:38 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute4.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 15 Jun 2022 15:58:38 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:date:feedback-id:feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to :in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender :subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender :x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; t=1655323118; x=1655409518; bh=2 WdVzvWQbhq0kNqA+scAwDwqooshH6OmNPMpqXEQZ/A=; b=llalXhBrS85GBrevh SJh9mjVWSqzckAPfI5EDV9MVXs3ZvyhWrSgsxBT4aK10JxDqRaDQZ1LLscALurEj RPSvQVt9Urvftl8gKwrE/y9WPs8Eh35mF7r3/bFyvmwr1kKjJuHJbT3xGUOgCxqs bwedJZor4ptlVwsA4fs7zkL/lJTXkK9Lf6eu361Yc2SZunVUXbthK2skMGRPwGsR oAgAmEOzjuikS6vxnIMtS3YAnizdz0NECwmyMmfLtJxQD6RFtSjfSKUr9srvuokk alwJPBrmcMRPQOn3W3iIaoRPhUgxXkthtm1NHJRfS0FUPpIhlgp1OejBoUQrEajp ruy9A==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:7TmqYlAwRX0a2jtLJqt1ubSVdQ5VkLTych4EVZEywS5LMScGKmQqtQ> <xme:7TmqYjiOk7G2PCwVtcRWrFnSvedzQ1epJNs83347pzt-H_t3V63IHGOTjR9mhNWqg 7c2PlEqIMql6g>
X-ME-Received: <xmr:7TmqYgk2mtApwQXSdQ4tSf3nEjQED1kYjXxvN98eJfGuceizBIeMWozcMPj0C43vJDPvJEHq0_68-AUW1l30e0IOC11ub-R5nTjvO635UnXvrnsR33s8gw>
X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvfedruddvuddgudegtdcutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfgh necuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepkfffgggfuffvfhfhjggtgfesth ekredttdefjeenucfhrhhomhepmfgvihhthhcuofhoohhrvgcuoehmohhorhgvsehnvght fihorhhkqdhhvghrvghtihgtshdrtghomheqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepfedtvdelie ejveekjefhueduheeviefhjeefvdfgudfhfffhudduudefgefgteevnecuvehluhhsthgv rhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomhepmhhoohhrvgesnhgvthifoh hrkhdqhhgvrhgvthhitghsrdgtohhm
X-ME-Proxy: <xmx:7TmqYvyDZEFnfN9ja-5Nn51KhSq8sCPbiPvFgMX-MQW2CYTqjq4iNA> <xmx:7TmqYqRe9JZtUE7eFdtzs7604C5SsbhQM0rkuDt_LDi2iUc5_OIgRg> <xmx:7TmqYiZAKstG1hmuGhHBdX2Aa7RDTDQlgTFE09F3KI3ufQ8OK2mjXg> <xmx:7jmqYhdVzVb7a_v8x95dQJFC0AsdELOmygxpgeSz-vFfzw9yC4ljYQ>
Feedback-ID: i5d8c41f0:Fastmail
Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 15 Jun 2022 15:58:37 -0400 (EDT)
Message-ID: <5d0374af-a044-8783-3825-d05213d638db@network-heretics.com>
Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2022 15:58:37 -0400
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.9.1
Subject: Re: Bad/Good ideas and damage control by experienced participants
Content-Language: en-US
To: ietf@ietf.org
References: <20220614144751.97882437791D@ary.local> <cf6d63e8-aebc-9c2a-1137-96c3d1c86570@gmail.com> <962ec243-78c9-fb54-1666-90b43b3b240c@foobar.org> <1cc2adda-f159-d658-a91e-a62658d916c6@lounge.org>
From: Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com>
In-Reply-To: <1cc2adda-f159-d658-a91e-a62658d916c6@lounge.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/YYbx4qTwGCjJf45pCAKpsl-YhJo>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2022 19:58:44 -0000

On 6/15/22 15:52, Dan Harkins wrote:

>   So instead of trying to define (and curtail) "rudeness", why don't 
> we try some real tolerance
> all around: don't assume the worst in others and give people a break 
> when you encounter
> some behavior that irks you.

(applause)

Keith