Re: [73attendees] Attendance by country

["Phillip Hallam-Baker" <[e-mail]>]

I don't see how it is possible for the IETF to schedule plenary meetings
that give WGs as much time as you have in a 2 day F2F.

If you have small children missed weekends count for a lot more than time
missed during the week, particularly when both parents work.

On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 9:25 AM, DRAGE, Keith (Keith) <
[e-mail]> wrote:

>  We just to complete the story:
>
> 3GPP meetings regularly start at 9:00 on Monday morning and finish at 3:00,
> 4:00 or even 6:00 on Friday.
>
> ETSI TISPAN meetings work similar schedules.
>
> Haven't been to ITU-T for a long while, but when I used to attend SG11,
> they went on for 3 weeks at a time, and finished when the traslators went
> home on Friday, and sometimes continued after, so sometimes 5:00 or 6:00.
> Only relaxation on that one was that these were generally SG or WP
> plenaries, and therefore you could let some of the technical people go.
>
> But the main point I am really making is that the shorter you make the main
> meeting, the greater the need for face to face ad hocs inbetween, so you may
> save 1 nights expenses in the main meeting by gaining an extra night and a
> travel bill, and another travel round trip elsewhere in the year. Plus all
> the problems of trying to schedule it in my already crowded calendar.
>
> regards
>
> Keith
>
>  ------------------------------
> *From:* Phillip Hallam-Baker [mailto:[e-mail]]
> *Sent:* Thursday, December 04, 2008 12:39 PM
> *To:* DRAGE, Keith (Keith)
> *Cc:* John C Klensin; [e-mail]
>
> *Subject:* Re: [73attendees] Attendance by country
>
>   IETF is the only standards body I work in that regularly schedules more
> than one Monday and Friday meeting a year.
>
> OASIS does not meet in plenary session. W3C only meets in plenary session
> once a year.
>
> OASIS and W3C WG chairs know that they cannot schedule F2F meetings for
> Mondays or Fridays, just does not happen. And I can't think of an
> international standards body that does. IEEE, ANSI, ETSI are all parochial,
> at least in theory. Two have a geographic descriptor in the title and the
> other decided to insert itself into US politics by lobbying Congress on
> immigration policy.
>
> On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 6:54 AM, DRAGE, Keith (Keith) <
> [e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>  And the chief problem with a light Friday, is that we have found it
>> impossible to schedule WG ad hocs anytime from lunchtime on Thursday because
>> people have decided they are going to start going home at that time.
>>
>> If you cancel Friday, then you might as well start about thinking about
>> cancelling Thursday, etc.
>>
>> Oh by the way, can we now schedule 3 ad hocs a year so we can actually get
>> the work done.
>>
>> And IETF is the only standards body I know of that seems to think the
>> people need weekends off for those very special US participants. Many home
>> locations of anyone outside NAR cannot make the connections to attend the
>> Friday sessions and get home even on Saturday morning. And I finally got
>> home from IETF last Thursday morning.
>>
>> regards
>>
>> Keith
>>
>>  ------------------------------
>> *From:* [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]]
>> *On Behalf Of *Phillip Hallam-Baker
>> *Sent:* Thursday, December 04, 2008 3:51 AM
>> *To:* John C Klensin
>> *Cc:* [e-mail]
>> *Subject:* Re: [73attendees] Attendance by country
>>
>>   Either meet on Friday or start mid-day Monday.
>>
>> One weekend is acceptable home-wise. two weekends are not.
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 10:43 PM, John C Klensin <[e-mail]<[e-mail]>
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --On Wednesday, 03 December, 2008 14:42 -0600 Dean Willis
>>> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>
>>> >> I have to second Mary's disagreement on canceling Fridays.
>>> >> If there   are sessions on Friday for me I don't want to
>>> >> travel that day   anyway.  What's the hurry?
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > Another $200 in travel costs (hotel and meals), opportunity of
>>> > >  $1,000 in billable time, plus an increased probability of
>>> > divorce costs for some attendees?
>>>
>>> Yep.  With small variations, that about covers it.
>>>
>>> Of course, if we also met Saturday and part of Sunday, that
>>> would guarantee Saturday night stays, which might help offset
>>> some of the travel costs (although not the hotel ones).    On
>>> the other hand, for those attendees for which it is relevant, it
>>> would probably further increase the divorce costs (or at least
>>> the divorce risk).
>>>
>>>        john
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/73attendees
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Author: The dotCrime Manifesto: How to Stop Internet Crime
>> http://dotcrimemanifesto.com
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Author: The dotCrime Manifesto: How to Stop Internet Crime
> http://dotcrimemanifesto.com
>
>


-- 
Author: The dotCrime Manifesto: How to Stop Internet Crime
http://dotcrimemanifesto.com

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