Re: [113attendees] hybrid meetings: the worst of both worlds

Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca> Mon, 28 March 2022 22:43 UTC

Return-Path: <mcr@sandelman.ca>
X-Original-To: 113attendees@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: 113attendees@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDF043A0451 for <113attendees@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 28 Mar 2022 15:43:37 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.909
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.909 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id N0UuUmo-SlU7 for <113attendees@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 28 Mar 2022 15:43:32 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from relay.sandelman.ca (relay.cooperix.net [IPv6:2a01:7e00:e000:2bb::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 057263A0490 for <113attendees@ietf.org>; Mon, 28 Mar 2022 15:43:31 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from dooku.sandelman.ca (unknown [75.98.19.151]) by relay.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9FFC41F45E; Mon, 28 Mar 2022 22:43:28 +0000 (UTC)
Received: by dooku.sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id 7CA591A0215; Tue, 29 Mar 2022 00:43:26 +0200 (CEST)
From: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
To: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
cc: 113attendees@ietf.org
In-reply-to: <30536bbd-c676-344e-1cbe-ae1529eda764@cs.tcd.ie>
References: <CAN40gStm5GUrqEOf-TwKEpitUUvBLDAvXC=asDVb-AxJ_bBq3Q@mail.gmail.com> <742B4ADD-593A-4722-B7ED-C24B107A1EA6@sunet.se> <a1d325f3-d246-e63f-1b93-0d97348a3063@cs.tcd.ie> <96015.1648472821@dooku> <30536bbd-c676-344e-1cbe-ae1529eda764@cs.tcd.ie>
Comments: In-reply-to Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> message dated "Mon, 28 Mar 2022 21:52:56 +0100."
X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7.1; GNU Emacs 26.3
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg="pgp-sha512"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2022 18:43:26 -0400
Message-ID: <115394.1648507406@dooku>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/113attendees/nkhNB-CISBmdD0O8iHfVjcJ3j2c>
Subject: Re: [113attendees] hybrid meetings: the worst of both worlds
X-BeenThere: 113attendees@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Mailing list for IETF 113 attendees <113attendees.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/113attendees>, <mailto:113attendees-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/113attendees/>
List-Post: <mailto:113attendees@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:113attendees-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/113attendees>, <mailto:113attendees-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2022 22:43:39 -0000

Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> wrote:
    >> It's an interesting suggestion, and I think we should try it somehow.
    >> It may be too radical a change for some.

    > Fair point. And it'd have to be done in some way so as to avoid big new
    > costs (e.g. for re-arranging rooms). OTOH, if there're only small
    > numbers in the WG sessions maybe keeping round-table setups would work
    > all week.

Round-table setups could actually be awesome with an agenda of more workshop
and less slideware.

But maybe there is some intermediate arrangement that satisfies both.
Maybe we could have the half-round table where the other half is virtual.

    > Again though, even if that particular suggestion isn't tried, I suspect
    > being more radical than 113 is going to be needed if we're gonna end up
    > succeeding with the hybrid meetings that are inevitable for the coming
    > years. (As someone else said, climate change alone is likely to be
    > sufficient to force that.)

I agree completely.

    >> (As a fellow morning-hater, I would personally find that order a
    >> problem.  I hack better in the evening, and sessions are a good
    >> motivation to wake up)

    > Wait, what? Isn't the IETF meeting agenda supposed to be designed
    > around me? :-)

The trick is for us to always get you to a time zone that is 6 hours ahead of
the meeting "9am"

I find that I can do meetings early (even 3am start) because there are other
people to engage me.  But, I can't write code/edit documents until after
noon, because that kind of activity has to be internally driven.


-- 
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>, Sandelman Software Works
 -= IPv6 IoT consulting =-