Re: [Recentattendees] IETF 100, Singapore -- proposed path forward and request for input

<l.wood@surrey.ac.uk> Mon, 23 May 2016 02:04 UTC

Return-Path: <l.wood@surrey.ac.uk>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3349312D5FC for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 22 May 2016 19:04:08 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.903
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.903 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=surreyac.onmicrosoft.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zOKsyA3yXB8F for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 22 May 2016 19:04:01 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail1.bemta14.messagelabs.com (mail1.bemta14.messagelabs.com [193.109.254.108]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8A80C12D5FB for <ietf@ietf.org>; Sun, 22 May 2016 19:04:01 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [193.109.255.147] by server-4.bemta-14.messagelabs.com id 96/3C-03277-F0562475; Mon, 23 May 2016 02:03:59 +0000
X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA1WSWUwTURSGvZ1pGQijQ8FwrOXBJgbQQCRu6Iu IG8YNEw1ogjrFoZ3YljpTSH3Q4EYq4hbr1hcWSxECxqKYUtBoI0GWiLgQgkpilAL1AVQkKrGx 0xkV79N/7vef5d4cAlNWKFQEY7UwnIk2aBRR+MkPTxNT5jCZOUtsP+PT/e4KPP1b0Ianl5Y68 Awsyz7tlme1ON5FZDmdP2TZ2F45a9IWWg/I9ZP2Kdz8JcI69b0WlaA+RRmKIpSUG8EJ/3tcDH oQPB/xRQgBTpVj4PFWy0XSh6Dh/qAU+BDYJiZDtkhCQc2HxmEnLug4KgPuvryNCTqW0kLbq1G FeJ8PzSOvJV0MzZfKwx6cWgifJ/zhe5LaC86hvgixgV0OjimvXACRVDKcqQ+GTYhKgOnnb8LJ GBUPTScuIEEDRYGzrRcT9VwY+xAMT4qocgTjV2olkwbab07KRL0N7gQqZIIJqCAGrf2nJdMGq G55LWkW3NWnpKqLwPbEISU0InjT4ZcqqaHu3iUJdMjBU3VVJn6ACo631eGiVsPo2wdyce5UGL hiV4h6MbiqPmEXUZJjxpMcM2yOGTZH+J9ioPPGR7wS4fUoiWe4YoZLSVuSquVYnd5ipFlDSlr aslQjw/O0jjHQWj41v9DYhEKLMyt0POiZa50PzSNkmrkkc3ZNjnK2tvDgET3N6/dzRQaG9yE1 QWiAPJ+fmaOM4RgdYy1gDaHt+4OBiNbEkXcETPJm2sizOhF1oQWqeLJMAJQA9EWmv2l/9vYFS lDFkig0iDLazHBG1vI/D6B4AmliyUGhSjRrsvytHgg1loUav5+fITS20P+QqgQ1b0APpzaymu aFJVu49q1rfq7yzUnY1bj9V9P1ytaB3o4eWxGp7r+cWOg6qvvqPZy98pBtd0/N2uWL6T3qhs0 Xakxd6+Nyi1cMuRXdby8Oj2HtOY/zHuXtUCPX2K1jfbkFddtXL0OBoLmzaWde7NJrZfuSC8a7 vTGrpyNHzx0Y3OTR4LyeTluEcTz9G9X57QCyAwAA
X-Env-Sender: l.wood@surrey.ac.uk
X-Msg-Ref: server-12.tower-72.messagelabs.com!1463969039!24563955!1
X-Originating-IP: [131.227.200.39]
X-StarScan-Received:
X-StarScan-Version: 8.34; banners=-,-,-
X-VirusChecked: Checked
Received: (qmail 18449 invoked from network); 23 May 2016 02:03:59 -0000
Received: from exht012p.surrey.ac.uk (HELO EXHT012P.surrey.ac.uk) (131.227.200.39) by server-12.tower-72.messagelabs.com with AES128-SHA encrypted SMTP; 23 May 2016 02:03:59 -0000
Received: from EXHY022V.surrey.ac.uk (131.227.201.104) by EXHT012P.surrey.ac.uk (131.227.200.39) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.3.348.2; Mon, 23 May 2016 03:03:58 +0100
Received: from emea01-db3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (131.227.201.241) by EXHY022v.surrey.ac.uk (131.227.201.104) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.224.2; Mon, 23 May 2016 03:03:58 +0100
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=surreyac.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector1-surrey-ac-uk; h=From:To:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=8na3FLMgbs2C8jmD9ZRzs+pRSwXLJZ2ftbvXxxwpitY=; b=Drmr97WQaEzUP/GPndpecwEZ0NKzuMwzvz5HTb7knh9qD2r6sSH12Gelxo61PRCPsu5j1cDSigauiGGVgpC8aN1+5LNLVVj8KskSNhAvYw34IxZ9d/ngYtyQEGbVjkMwreV1rDtMzle+jKJLdjtheHmQyWlUWjx1SHKRyqvjJN8=
Received: from DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com (10.141.238.15) by DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com (10.141.238.15) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.506.2; Mon, 23 May 2016 02:03:58 +0000
Received: from DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com ([10.141.238.15]) by DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com ([10.141.238.15]) with mapi id 15.01.0506.007; Mon, 23 May 2016 02:03:58 +0000
From: l.wood@surrey.ac.uk
To: melinda.shore@gmail.com, lear@cisco.com, ietf@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] IETF 100, Singapore -- proposed path forward and request for input
Thread-Topic: [Recentattendees] IETF 100, Singapore -- proposed path forward and request for input
Thread-Index: AQHRsHEt6XcH+jxdGU6fPbpGrUBj/Z/Dm8iAgAAJaICAABMygIAApuKAgABU0YCAABVoAIAAUB0AgAAnZQCAAAZCAIAAAH+AgACFu/4=
Date: Mon, 23 May 2016 02:03:58 +0000
Message-ID: <DB4PR06MB457C6319227941B3024666FAD4E0@DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com>
References: <20160517181436.24852.58610.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <3945cc1f-3e99-0fcb-e983-ed2e46fa871c@nostrum.com> <CA+9kkMAWFQDrT6WqTGz=6LcDiBkg+iuLEuSzeSqfZA4-J-tvZg@mail.gmail.com> <CABcZeBMGpKFiA78iQDFa5xaM0r0q_3LfLO_JKxaWJ9CBUTeaLg@mail.gmail.com> <C5B9F952-FEFC-4B73-9AC6-E050F59A74CB@consulintel.es> <CA+9kkMCQBdZOebSo9WwEd14+Bgh64Tpd+8BfF+uzbDRSV-gFxw@mail.gmail.com> <88c09ff2-51d0-d419-1253-ddd8e6049397@cisco.com> <CA+9kkMBi3pR+N3E21j=gNAKNNndX8NvpnwEJcNAYpJGpx6A6mw@mail.gmail.com> <093f7f6f-4d4a-334e-e476-a0b562bd9fd7@cisco.com> <5741EEE6.2040302@gmail.com> <c4aeef86-5c0b-1858-3340-1d1cf4dffcc3@cisco.com>, <5741F491.7080908@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <5741F491.7080908@gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-AU, en-US
Content-Language: en-AU
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [132.245.226.69]
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: ccf7bb41-f26d-4b8e-d8e9-08d382ae80a2
x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DB4PR06MB457; 5:nwmwNkTsGWXfwujf+88tnY/dP6jsmYvMhjBxOJ+Lz/NoIx9vzca71cw8592sA77fwivNL5n1FHy+bovjCudRj+gZ5a06wEL6NnnL/1xRZfozcKmfwFCRQaQ+C3mEUWNTn3xe5ChXZdcGOHj16mppHg==; 24:SjfWdics7jk+eOi6Etv7xYjEJ9nicdOSDoxMga+pyMU0y2c8KFYtAGdNyXipqEw60fVB3y7sLYMpL6uqvDbzI4F4a5HmCmKBDSPr7c3rirA=; 7:mOfbEorPxc9TDNUxCzBunZaz1SZH6S3DbLCu14Gr3cdLKUcxjAvdKbHaoZCg6GRDttGjBfBXOg+FRkAoEBMF7CLX42Hid7GDq1+97P9GCfouGv1ChZuDjxe47Z3ctrkv3//4+QdTAGfg27PP3NrV9cMZBvdoSXtmbQyhkq3F8adXv2p8mGHOaVYglP3l/Vww
x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DB4PR06MB457;
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <DB4PR06MB457A8F15EEA6FEC561EC41AAD4E0@DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com>
x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:;
x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(601004)(2401047)(5005006)(8121501046)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DB4PR06MB457; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DB4PR06MB457;
x-forefront-prvs: 0951AB0A30
x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(377454003)(24454002)(5002640100001)(1720100001)(15975445007)(77096005)(2950100001)(2900100001)(10400500002)(6116002)(3846002)(1220700001)(74482002)(586003)(15198665003)(3280700002)(3660700001)(86362001)(5004730100002)(122556002)(2906002)(15395725005)(102836003)(19580405001)(5003600100002)(19580395003)(3900700001)(5008740100001)(81166006)(8676002)(76576001)(106116001)(93886004)(11100500001)(8936002)(2501003)(189998001)(74316001)(92566002)(87936001)(9686002)(50986999)(54356999)(5001770100001)(76176999)(107886002)(66066001)(33656002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DB4PR06MB457; H:DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; LANG:en;
spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23
spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 23 May 2016 02:03:58.1417 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 6b902693-1074-40aa-9e21-d89446a2ebb5
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB4PR06MB457
X-OrganizationHeadersPreserved: DB4PR06MB457.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com
X-CrossPremisesHeadersFiltered: EXHY022v.surrey.ac.uk
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/UWvDfeSFrNHAelvQsTmWXwqchBs>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 May 2016 02:04:08 -0000

Melinda,

you mean like disadvantaging the families of attendees, who don't participate in meetings,  rather than disadvantaging the attendees who do?

Lloyd Wood
http://about.me/lloydwood
________________________________________
From: ietf <ietf-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, 23 May 2016 4:04 AM
To: Eliot Lear; ietf@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] IETF 100, Singapore -- proposed path forward and request for input

On 5/22/16 10:02 AM, Eliot Lear wrote:
> Sorry- but there is no doubt that f2f meetings are high bandwidth
> compared to any electronic form of communication.  And I'm saying that
> if we're going to have them we have a choice of who we disadvantage, for
> surely we will disadvantage someone.  This discussion is about how that
> choice is made.

Allow me to suggest that avoiding disadvantaging people who do not
actually participate might be somewhat lower priority than avoiding
disadvantaging those who do.

Melinda