Re: [rtcweb] confirming sense of the room: mti codec

Andrew Allen <aallen@blackberry.com> Sat, 06 December 2014 02:23 UTC

Return-Path: <aallen@blackberry.com>
X-Original-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D30F1A8A11 for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 5 Dec 2014 18:23:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.91
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aeuiirF_q8Uq for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 5 Dec 2014 18:23:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-p02.blackberry.com (smtp-p02.blackberry.com [208.65.78.89]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EBC71A8A4E for <rtcweb@ietf.org>; Fri, 5 Dec 2014 18:23:08 -0800 (PST)
Received: from xct101cnc.rim.net ([10.65.161.201]) by mhs213cnc.rim.net with ESMTP/TLS/AES128-SHA; 05 Dec 2014 21:23:04 -0500
Received: from XCT111CNC.rim.net (10.65.161.211) by XCT101CNC.rim.net (10.65.161.201) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.210.2; Fri, 5 Dec 2014 21:23:03 -0500
Received: from XMB122CNC.rim.net ([fe80::28c6:fa1c:91c6:2e23]) by XCT111CNC.rim.net ([::1]) with mapi id 14.03.0210.002; Fri, 5 Dec 2014 21:23:03 -0500
From: Andrew Allen <aallen@blackberry.com>
To: Adam Roach <adam@nostrum.com>, David Singer <singer@apple.com>, Jean-Marc Valin <jmvalin@mozilla.com>
Thread-Topic: [rtcweb] confirming sense of the room: mti codec
Thread-Index: AQHQEJCKEBti1FXXNkmH1ALOez9gJ5yBvm8AgAA6CwCAACgmAP//s+Mw
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2014 02:23:02 +0000
Message-ID: <BBF5DDFE515C3946BC18D733B20DAD2339987D08@XMB122CNC.rim.net>
References: <E3FA0C72-48C5-465E-AE15-EB19D8D563A7@ieca.com> <54820E74.90201@mozilla.com> <FCDCD184-549C-4111-ACDB-7C466A2EE9D1@apple.com> <548260D2.2020703@nostrum.com>
In-Reply-To: <548260D2.2020703@nostrum.com>
Accept-Language: en-CA, en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [10.65.160.249]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rtcweb/1x80-atyqGNQmR_TIQkybRWGMMo
Cc: "rtcweb@ietf.org" <rtcweb@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] confirming sense of the room: mti codec
X-BeenThere: rtcweb@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Real-Time Communication in WEB-browsers working group list <rtcweb.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rtcweb/>
List-Post: <mailto:rtcweb@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2014 02:23:11 -0000

Adam,

However if you look at it another way:

A majority of the market share of the desktop browser market (Microsoft and Apple) are against this and a significant share of the mobile browser market (Apple, Microsoft and BlackBerry) are against this.

That doesn’t seem to me as major progress towards consensus by the people who are supposed to actually comply with the two MTI decision in order to ensure interoperability. At least not in the real world of shipping product where it really matters.

Andrew

-----Original Message-----
From: rtcweb [mailto:rtcweb-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Adam Roach
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2014 8:50 PM
To: David Singer; Jean-Marc Valin
Cc: rtcweb@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] confirming sense of the room: mti codec

On 12/5/14 15:26, David Singer wrote:
>> On Dec 5, 2014, at 11:58 , Jean-Marc Valin <jmvalin@mozilla.com> wrote:
>> 3) This is the only proposal that gets support from both camps
> if you could speak only for yourself, and not others, that might be better.  You’re claiming support by other people here.
>

If I read Jean-Marc's statement correctly, it's not speaking on behalf of other people; it's using what they have already said, on the record [1], as a valid part of his rationale.

I'd like to reinforce this sentiment. I support this proposal not because I think it is the best solution, but because it is the first MTI video codec proposal that the actual implementors in this technology space have even remotely agreed on since the discussion began. I support this proposal primarily because it is the only solution we have yet seen that has a credible chance of succeeding.

That's a powerful reason -- at least, for those people invested in this technology -- but it necessarily involves pointing to the positions of others. This is not the same as making statements on their behalf, as you claim; it is merely acknowledging that they've already made such statements.

/a


____
[1] I'm not going through the effort of gathering citations here, as I would expect that you, and all other involved participants, are sufficiently familiar with the ongoing conversation to make doing so unnecessary. If you'd like to make the claim such positions have *not* been asserted by the parties in question, I'll happily point you to a trove of relevant emails, meeting minutes, slide decks, and audio recordings.

_______________________________________________
rtcweb mailing list
rtcweb@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb